Correctional Services Minister Ngcondo Balfour is quoted in the papers today as saying something so weird that if I did not know any better I would wonder whether he had been smoking some Durban Poison before talking to the media. According to the Business Day:
Last night, Correctional Services Minister Ngconde Balfour said Shaik was in “the final phase of his terminal condition”. Evidence on Shaik’s health was given to the parole board by three medical practitioners, he said.
“The three medical practitioners’ collective submission shows a unanimous conclusion that Mr Shaik is in ‘the final phase of his terminal condition’,” said Balfour. “One even went as far as saying that his condition has reached an irreversible condition. Having studied the contents of the report as submitted to me by the said parole board, I am of the view that the decision they made is correct,” said Balfour.
This does not make sense and seems like a clear and quite absurd contradiction. Which means either that the Minister is really, really, stupid or that he is lying. Maybe both.
Let`s have a look. The Minister claims that the three medical practitioners were unanimous in concluding that Shaik was in the final phases of a terminal illness. This means the three doctors agreed that Shaik is on his death bed and will die in days or weeks.
But then the Minister says one of the doctors ¨even went as far as saying that his condition has reached an irreversible condition¨. So, one doctor thinks that there is nothing that can be done to save Shaik and that his conditions is irreversable. He will therefore die. But the other two doctors were supposed to agree that Shaik is in the final phases of a terminal illness, yet, they do not agree that his condition is irreversable and could therefore not agree that the illness is terminal either?
What am I missing – or am I going mad?
I have yet to hear of a condition which doctors agree has made one terminally (i.e. one WILL die) ill, yet that a majority of the same doctors believe can be reversed. If the condition can be reversed, the illness is not terminal and thus will not lead to the imminent death of the patient.
So this statement by the Minister is, to be kind, an absurdity and an embarrassment. When politicians are caught in such an obvious contradiction, my first suspicion is that the polician is lying through his teeth. My second suspicion is that the politician was forced to lie because someone higher up ordered him to take a bullet for the team.
Only a full disclosure of the evidence will help us to understand whether the Minister was lying and was covering up the illegal acts of the Parole Board when he made this statement or whether the Minister merely ¨misspoke¨ and was just too stupid to understand the reports given to him.
Either way, such a Minister is not worth his salt and should be fired forthwith. I trust the ANC – who claims to believe in the Rule of Law and competent governance – will request the President to relieve this bumbling (or dishonest?) Minister from his duties immediately.
I also trust that the ANC – in order to clear up any suspicion that its President or someone else on his behalf had interfered illegally with the Parole Board process – will immediately call for a full investigation into this deeply suspicious developments that led to Shaik´s release from prison.
If the ANC defends the Parole Board and the Minister, or fails to call for a full disclosure of the facts, we will know that it has something to hide. I am waiting…. But I am not hopeful.
Prof, with respect I do not see any contradiction in what Minister Balfour is quoted having said. It is clear that all 3 doctors are of the view that Shaik is in the final phase of his terminal condition. In emphasizing this view, one of the doctors went on to say that the terminal condition is irreversible. Nowhere is it stated that the other two doctors disagreed with the irreversibility of the condition! I do not understand how you justify the following paragraph:
“I have yet to hear of a condition which doctors agree has made one terminally ill, yet that a majority of the same doctors believe can be reversed. If the condition can be reversed, the illness is not terminal and thus will not lead to the immenent death of the patient.”
This is just like 3 judges dismissing a claim and one of the judges goes on to state that even if the plaintiff were to appeal he would not grant leave to appeal.
I will say this again; normally doctors do not say a patients condition is irreversible because there are cases where patients have been miraculously healed. One of the doctors in this case is saying even a miracle won’t save Sheik. Remember that the minister in the morning (the one you did not watch) said the doctors examined Sheik at different times and made independent findings or diagnosis. It was going to be very suspicious if they had had the same findings and wording on their reports. But I have known the Prof to believe that lawyers and judges would word their arguments and judgement exactly the same.
Doesn’t matter Bongs – Shaik is and evil, decadent bastard. He probably bribed those doctors, the minister and the parole board just like the bribed the entire government and the ANC.
Yes bongs but what you seem to be missing out is the doctors who submitted there reports seems to have been Shaiks very own doctors….if the DCS used also one of there own doctors then procedures where followed to an extent but if the DCS did not use or was one of the 3 doctors to submit a submission then there is a breach in policy.
I think bongs
do yourself a flavour check this out i think there is a lack of understanding what Terminaly ill means in the case of a medical parole. it does not mean to send someone home so he can be cured it means for someone to go home and die
http://www.chr.up.ac.za/undp/domestic/docs/caselaw_26.pdf
Guys we must remember that English is not Balfour’s language, as such, he can not express himself as well in English (I am not saying he cant speak English; there is a difference). As an English speaker, I do see the “contradiction”. I dont think it can, therefore, be assumed that Balfour can be regarded as stupid due to a poor command of English though.
This is all hogwash – Shabir Shaik is not terminally ill. Hipertension (50% of all South Africans have this – me too), depression (40% of all South Africans have this – sometimes me too), high blood-sugar levels and Insulin depression (35% of all South Africans have this), high cholestrol (39% of all South Africans have this – me too), etc (I think herein I caught all that Shaik purportedly suffers of), are all controlable diseases. Any GP or Specialist worth his / her fee will tell you that they can be stabilized and controlled with medication, and that they (in combination or individually) are rarely if ever terminal, unless you stop using your medication. Schabir will survive this, and he is getting more than R 5 Mil back from the Asset Forfeiture Unit. Quite a pay for two and a half years in hospital. Jacob Zuma, Nconde Balfour, Parole Board – I (no, we) smell a rat. Why did Zuma have so much to say about this before Shaik’s release? (Is he the President already?) Why did Bloem not know about this? Why does even Jody Kollapen think a review would be in order? Why keep it all silent (not for Jacob Zuma though) until a few hours before his release? Why refuse to divulge the medical evidence? Why …? Why …? Why …?
Anonymouse @ 6:19 pm
“Hipertension (50% of all South Africans have this – me too), depression (40% of all South Africans have this – sometimes me too),”
Did it ever occur to you that if you stopped indulging in paranoid conspiracy theories you may start feeling a little better ?
‘”Shaik was in a cardiac ward where patients only drank rooibos tea because it doesn’t have caffeine. But Shaik would demand Five Roses Tea and ate Debonairs and Steers food or meals delivered by his wife or brother,” the staff member said. According to the staff member Shaik did not appear gravely ill, he was rude, given preferential treatment and was never on a special diet.
“Shaik failed to accept that he was a convicted criminal and whenever he was told not to eat certain food he would respond by saying ‘Do you know who I am?’” (From the Cape Times, March 4)
South Africa never stops surprising you…
What price the first foto of Schabir hitting one of those fat cuban’s in the backyard with a whiskey? I bet there are a number of telephotos straining as we speak.
We need an inquiry as Jody suggests. If Shaik is really ill as is suggested he should welcome it.
If not, the rule of law is subverted and trust in the whole fabric of society with it.
This has the potential of destroying the country.
Imagine Chris Hani gets shot but this time its 2009, and the politician in question if Sexwale – is his neighbor going to report it and testify to the police like when it happened in 1993?
Imagine the Boeremag members planting bombs, but this time its 2009. Are the Afrikaner detectives that put them behind bars going to do the same?
Not if they don’t believe that we have the rule of law in SA.
Justice must be seen to be done.
Bongs, I fear you are not a doctor and do not understand the definition of terminal illness (which is also made clear in the act). Only where the medical evidence is clear and unambiguous, namely, where the doctors are absolutely sure the prisoner WILL die and will die soon, such a person cannot be released as such a person will not be terminally ill. A terminal illness is by its very nature not reversible. It is like a judgment by the Constitutional Court which cannot be reversed on appeal because the CC is the highest court. Doctors are usually very careful (erring on the side of compassion) before stating a person is terminally ill because that is a death sentence. If Shaik is not dead in a month or two, he was not terminally ill as defined by the Act and we will know that the MInister, the Parole Board and everyone else involved have acted in a scandalous manner. If he is dead in a month, I will be very contrite and apologise to the Minister, the Parole Board and the Shaik family. I will even wash Mo`s feet…. But givcen the fact that several courts have foudn Schabir to be a liar and a crook, I am not so sure he will not make a slow but steady recovery….
Below is an e-mail that landed in my inbox from a friend and a Zuma supporter:
Schabir is the worst crybaby who doesnt care which organisation or who he embarrasses as he blunders on his way.His brothers are educated one being the fugitive Chippy and the other Yunus the lawyer.Mo is apparently an engineer or something like that.
Schabir is the dodgy one who didn’t finish school and is too daft to know that you don’t just fake qualifications like B Sc Engineering (as was exposed to his embarrassment in his trial).He cold hardly stay for six months behind bars without throwing his toys.
He probably used the R7million rand which the NPA gave back to him in December to fake illness. A poisoned chalice is this parole.
Moral of the story: DO NOT COLLUDE WITH SELF CENTRED CRY-BABIES
The short-sighted idiot didn’t calculate that he MUST PLAY SICK FOR ALWAYS TILL HE DIES. He probably thinks he can go and play golf again. Actually medical parole means going home to die.
The tragedy of Mzantsi is that there are so many like him. Self centred opinionated little schmucks plundering the public purse who don’t have the balls to do the time when they’re bust.
Pathetic little dregs of humanity.
Zuma wanted to give him presidential pardon AFTER the elections so the timing absolves JZ from this jail break.
The DA,COPE and ID will have a field day NOT PAYING ATTENTION to their campaigns but searching in the dark for proof that the ANC is responsible for this jail break.
Good luck to them. A lot of boers never went to prison who killed people in the most horrendous fashion.
PdV
“If Shaik is not dead in a month or two,”
In fact “terminal illness” implies a month or six.
ozoneblue // Mar 4, 2009 at 7:53 pm
Ozone:
Happy to see you have a sense of humour.
Unfortunately it seems the “system” is broke.
The absolute truth is if He dies in the near future:
I hope he does die to justify the “system” because otherwise the “system” will contribute more to the death of a “constitutional democracy”.
I hope he does not die and the “system” is exposed and thereafter “fixed”.
As an old fashioned human being I hope he lives a long and happy life.
Pierre,
The fact that the other two doctors did not specifically state that his condition is irreversable surely does not mean that they disagree with the other one.
Maybe after having stated that he is in the final stages of a terminal disease, they did not deem it necessary to go as far as stating that it is irreversable. Maybe because final stages of terminal disease already implies that it is irreversable?
I am more interested to know what exactly the terminal illness is. Surely it can’t be any of the illnesses that were mentioned? It does not seem that we are going to get much information out of DCS. We’ll have to wait and see how long Shaik actually lives to find out whether he was really terminally ill.
Horror of Horrors:
I hope they did not pardon him on the basis of an AIDS related decease.
Nobody dies of that – right.
Has anybody ever heared of a ” doctor/s-patient confidentiality”? Is there 1 rule for De Vos, Anonymouse, Spuy, Zille with regards to their illness confidentiality AND another for Shaik, I mean, dont we always get lectures of ONE LAW FOR ALL from Professor De Vos daily? And by the way, just by the way, who the hell, I mean, just who the hell said that terminal illness ALWAYS means that a person dies after a certain short period? It is not ALWAYS predictable since the actual dying process and accurate time lines thereof are never 100 percent conclusive, i.e No doctor/specialist can tell you exactly when are you gonna die. They can make an educated prediction but trust me mense-religion aside-there s many testimonies of people who were given few wks to live by learned doctors, but still went beyond 10 or more years. Surely we all know this is possible if we want to be honest.
STOP elevating doctors to some sort of GODS, its no wonder why they are so arrogant! You should look at their handwritings…typical typical, or rather, “extra ordinarily arrogant” handwritings to quote you know who! Him who used to call people ultra leftists.
Spuy: Seek help!!
Eish!!!! – Sometimes ne… we just ‘cun’t’ beleeve…..!
“Bongs, I fear you are not a doctor and do not understand the definition of terminal illness (which is also made clear in the act). Only where the medical evidence is clear and unambiguous, namely, where the doctors are absolutely sure the prisoner WILL die and will die soon, such a person cannot be released as such a person will not be terminally ill.”
Prof, it is not about my not being a doctor and not understanding the meaning of terminal illness. All I pointed out to you is that there is no condradiction in what Minister Balfour said. What is ambiguous about 3 doctors stating that a patient is terminally ill and 1 doctor going on to add the obvious – that the condition is irreversible? To expand on your example: after delivering a unanimous judgment, if Langa CJ were to remind the litigants that the judgment is final and cannot be reversed he would be stating the obvious – tautology!
Shakira @ 10:29pm has said it better!
Spuy @ 12:31 am
“Has anybody ever heared of a ” doctor/s-patient confidentiality”? Is there 1 rule for De Vos, Anonymouse, Spuy, Zille with regards to their illness confidentiality AND another for Shaik, I mean, dont we always get lectures of ONE LAW FOR ALL from Professor De Vos daily?”
Precisely. You should see my comment on the other thread about how get quacks in all professions.
The only irreversable condition with Shaik is that of being a liar and a crook.
Zille’s health has not been used to set fraudsters free from prison. Obviously, Shaik’s health is not a matter of confidentiality if his alleged terminal illness is announced as an excuse to give him preferential treatment. Obviously, being told that Shaik has a terminal illness from all the take-aways he ate while reclining in the luxury of a hospital bed for the duration of his great turmoil in prison infringes on his patient-doctor confidentiality.
By that reasoning, you could argue that prison thugs like Shaik is not allowed to see the prison doctor at all, since prison doctors are not monitoring the health of convicted criminals in confidence in the first place.
Shaik is a public figure. His fraud has implicated Jacob Zuma. We as the public have a right to know everything about Shaik – from how much he earns to which side of the bed he prefers to how many times he coughed today. This is to ensure transparency and accountability with regards to dealing with our tax money.
If Shaik messed around with his own money and ran into trouble, I’d understand the need for privacy, As things stand now, Shaik does not deserve privacy. He did not make a family trust fund disappear. He was caught with his hand in the public funds cookie jar.
We know he is dishonest and he has a character of questionable integrity. This is not being judgemental – he served prison time for being immoral. He has the papers that state he is a thug. What more evidence do you need? The fact that Mo Shaik called for making unconstitutional exceptions for Shabir puts a big question mark over his head too in my books.
It goes without doubt that, Mr Shaik is getting the better end of the law. As I am not a medical doctor I cannot comment on the health of Shaik. But I am pretty sure that there are prisoners who are similarly, if not worse a ‘condition’ that Shaik has, who are denied parole.
What is irritating to me, is the continues abuse of power by some individuals. An example of this which comes straight to mind is that of Mr Toni Yengeni.
I do wish Mr Shaik well. Someone who is on there way out do not indeed need all this publicity.
Spuy // Mar 5, 2009 at 12:31 am
“but trust me mense-religion aside-there s many testimonies of people who were given few wks to live by learned doctors, but still went beyond 10 or more years. Surely we all know this is possible if we want to be honest.”
Are you already preparing us for the fact that Shaik is going to make a remarkable revovery?
PAuL Brislin at 8:57 am
“But I am pretty sure that there are prisoners who are similarly, if not worse a ‘condition’ that Shaik has, who are denied parole”
That is pure speculation when we do not know the circumstances and criteria for the estimated 20 other prisoners who are getting medical parole every year.
As I pointed out the law definitely differentiates between prisoners with a life sentence for crimes such as murder and robbery where the final decision lays with the minister. There may be countless other prisoners who are not released on medical parole simply because they come form a socio-economic background where they can obtain better medical care inside the correctional system.
BTW – on the side, according to some sources an estimated 4000 prisoners die in our prisons because of all possible causes ever year. A very interesting stat if you consider the size of our prison population of 165 000 – that is a mortality rate of around 2% in a high risk population and then you are forced to believe this AIDS epidemic hype.
I assume Sheik is suffering from a heart condition.
Could it be the Doctors are convinced that his illness is terminal if he remains in “Jail”. He MAY however survive quite a few years of life at home with his family in a less stressful enviroment. Would that still satisfy the law?
Also you said:
“Doctors are usually very careful (erring on the side of compassion) before stating a person is terminally ill because that is a death sentence.”
Yes I would say in most cases that is true, patients and families would not want to hear that they are terminally ill. I this case however, the authorities and the patient would prefer to hear a diagnosis of terminal illness so I think these doctors would err on that side.
So… It’s a Ms Meenaaz Adams fulfilling the role of chairperson of the Westville parole board. Haven’t found anything regarding her political affiliation yet, but I did find an interesting document of minutes kept during a meeting of the 12 parole board chairpersons.
Also on the site is her personal cell number: 083 786 8796. Maybe some intrepid journalist could contact her and get some comment?
The site, located here:
http://www.pmg.org.za/minutes/20060904-parole-board-implementation-input-twelve-parole-board-chairpersons-minister
has a discussion on eligibility for medical parole where Ms Adams professed not to even know the procedures that are followed to parole a person on medical grounds. This has to raise the question: what type of qualifications does Ms Adams have if she doesn’t even know parole procedure?
Even more interesting, Ms Adams apparently stated that “some offenders would abuse the medical parole system to be released early”. Ironic.
From the Independent:
“Balfour found time to read Shaik’s application for parole, but more politically sensitive decisions still wait on his desk, writes Louise Flanagan.
An apartheid hit squad killer who applied for parole in late 2007, Butana Almond Nofemela, has been trying for months to get the minister to make a decision on his release.
This week his lawyer, Julian Knight, said Nofemela was still in jail, awaiting the minister’s decision regarding his parole.
Nofemela is eligible to apply for parole after serving 20 years of a life sentence. He has now been in jail for 21-and-a-half years.
Knight has previously said that Balfour’s failure to make a decision was political interference in the parole process.
Nofemela is serving a life sentence for the murder of a Brits farmer, Johannes Hendrik Lourens, during an armed robbery.
While in jail, he avoided the gallows by confessing to involvement in the police hit squad murder of anti-apartheid activist Griffiths Mxenge, a crime for which he received amnesty.
Nofemela’s parole application was approved by the local prison committee in November 2007.
In February last year, it was approved by the National Council for Correctional Services (NCCS) and sent to Balfour for final approval – but nothing happened.
In December, Knight won a Pretoria High Court order that instructed Balfour to make a decision on the prisoner’s parole within 10 court days. One day before the court’s deadline, Balfour sent the parole decision back to the NCCS – avoiding making a decision.
Instead, Balfour queried some of the documents, including the age of some documents, and said Nofemela should undergo the department’s pre-release programmes.
The NCCS will discuss Balfour’s queries at its meeting later this month.
At the time, Knight said the age of the documents indicated how long the department had taken to process the application, and that confirmation that Nofemela had undergone the programmes was included in the file.”
ozoneblue // Mar 5, 2009 at 9:43 am
“That is pure speculation when we do not know the circumstances and criteria for the estimated 20 other prisoners who are getting medical parole every year.”
The correctional service act states very clearly what the circumstances and criteria should be for medical Parole what you meant to say is on what grounds was shaik released on….that we dont know
“As I pointed out the law definitely differentiates between prisoners with a life sentence for crimes such as murder and robbery where the final decision lays with the minister.”
definitely differentiates? yes on life sentences for murder and crime the final decision lays with the minister but im interested to know your interpretation does that mean because there is an extra procedure for a murderer that he has less rights before someone with lets say fraud? or he is looked at last becuase he is a murderer?
“AIDS epidemic hype”
I really dont find this funny anymore, and for your to not take this disease seriously the rest of the human race does, you seem to be have such a lack of a moral compass with you.
Go do yourself a favour AIDS is the biggest epdemic known in the history of the human race, there simply is no care for it, find out for me how many people have died from the disease then come back to me and say you still dont believe in the hype, cos then your just stupid.
Wessel van Rensburg (AKA mhambi) @ 11:11 am
” An apartheid hit squad killer who applied for parole in late 2007, Butana Almond Nofemela, has been trying for months to get the minister to make a decision on his release.”
We don’t wanted convicted killers suffering from hypertension on the loose. They pose a danger to society.
ozoneblue
lol you cracking me up to day you do release that Nofemela isnt applying for medical parole?
Chris Mcdaniel @ 11:29 am
“and for your to not take this disease seriously the rest of the human race does”
Please don’t come with your pseudo-moralistic nonsense. It is really hard to take a disease with a mortality rate less than 2% even in a high risk population seriously. How does AIDS compare to the Black Plague that hit Europe in the middle ages – it doesn’t even compare.
“The Black Death is estimated to have killed 30% to 60% of Europe’s population.[13][14][15] It may have reduced the world’s population from an estimated 450 million to between 350 and 375 million in 1400.[16]”
If you can’t argue the facts please don’t try and baffle us with your bullshit.
Convicted killers pose a threat to society but convicted fraudsters don’t?
Can you say double standard?
ozoneblue // Mar 5, 2009 at 11:39 am
wow you have got to be the mos ignorant bastwerd on this planet., sorry i just wish i could smack you…
I think your figures are grossly exaggerated not surprising considering your personality, you do seem to over exaggerate It wiped out roughly 1/3 of Europe’s population, which means it killed about 25-50 million
please do this for me, go to the closest hosiptial and ask how many people they have there with aids and how many people they have there that died yearly of aids.
man what an ass hole
Garg Unzola
dont bother ozoneblue doesnt understand the type of paroles we have in this country and what each criteria’s are
@Chris Mcdaniel
Are you legitimately, a citizen of the Republic of South Africa?
khosi // Mar 5, 2009 at 12:42 pm
no im a citizen of the US but i have permanent residence here but dont stress im very clued up on your law but i do feel abit south african, ek kan jou taal praat bro…..Sawubona
Chris Mcdaniel // Mar 5, 2009 at 1:25 pm
Noted.
Oh please, let’s just get to the point. The man is not going to die. Well, not yet, sadly. Zuma is showing us the middle finger. The order to release that pizza fiend came directly from that Janus-faced, sex addcited chameleon.
By the way, about 20% of South Africans have AIDS.
The rate is much higher among pregnant women, of which about 30% had AIDS in 2006. This puts our AIDS epidemic among pregnant women on roughly the same scale as the Black Plague of Europe. Food for thought.
The main issue in this blog is the horrific gaffe which Balfour made. You do not state the obvious after you have stated the obvious. If the doctors unanimously agreed he was about to peg, there is no reason to emphasise the point – saying somebody is about to die is enough of a point. The only reason you would reinforce this point by saying that one of the doctors even thought his condition was irreversible, was if the other two didn’t, but got told that they should.
This whole thing stinks to high heaven – again. We’re getting used to living in the stench of shit that our politicians seem to create, but I thought I’d point it out.
This man was convicted of flagrant fraud. Even after the irrefutable facts that convicted him came to light, he still refused to admit guilt, or show remorse. He then wangled a stay in hospital for his terrible ailments, where the doctors evidently prescribed whisky and cigars, and as many family and friends visiting as possible. After people eventually started getting iffy about the fact that he was supposed to be in jail, he finally got sent back. Now suddenly he is terminally ill (well, sort of, depending on which doctor you ask), and he is back at home in his comfy bed.
Does anybody actually believe anything the Shaiks do or say? Does anybody really believe he’s going to die? If it’s such a cut and dried issue, why does he not release his medical records? Just because they’re automatically confidential does not mean that he himself cannot release them. That would shut us all up – and I don’t know about anybody else, but if I was on my deathbed, I would do everything in my power to make those I was leaving behind have an easy ride. Releasing the records would do just such a thing – the family would be able to grieve in peace, not surrounded by journalists asking uncomfortable questions. It would also help establish credibility of the parole board, although I doubt Shaik cares too much about anything that doesn’t impact his own pocket.
Unless of course the records would show that he is in fact not terminally ill, and that he has received some sort of special favours…hmmmm….high blood pressure is a chronic condition, not terminal…stage 4 cancer is terminal. There is no debate as to what terminal means in this context, otherwise prisoners with all sorts of diseases could be applying for parole.
The man is bullshitting everybody, and he and JZ know that nobody actually believe that he’s about to die – but they just don’t care. Because it’s their country now, and they can do whatever they bloody well please…South African post-liberation politics par excellance!
ozoneblue, was that a joke about not wanting convicted killers suffering from hypertension on the loose? If so, I thought it was funny. But if I was Jacob Zuma I am not so sure I would want Schabir Shaik on the loose either. He loves to talk. He is a liar. He is a showman. Things can get tricky…..
Big Slipper:
That is a serious gaffe. Notice how the guilty parties are pussyfooting specifically to avoid stating unequivocally that Shaik is in fact suffering from a life threatening disease.
If three prison doctors had a look at Shaik, why can’t we know their verdict? Why should we be satisfied with second hand non-descript descriptions?
If Shaik is eligible for medical parole, surely we may know the reasons why? Oh, I forgot. When it comes to the ANC you’re not supposed to notice that the emperor is naked.
Garg Unzola @ 7:34 am
“If three prison doctors had a look at Shaik, why can’t we know their verdict? Why should we be satisfied with second hand non-descript descriptions?”
Because it is unconstitutional. PdV ought to be able to tell you that.
Interestingly, according a report in IOL, an amendment to the Correctional Services Act, approved by Parliament last year and due to come into effect shortly, would have given the Inspecting Judge for Prisons the power to refer Shaik’s parole for review.
The plot, it appears, thickens further.
http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?from=rss_News&set_id=1&click_id=79&art_id=vn20090306045848183C575663
We are all “in the final phase of a terminal condition”. We are all slowly dying.
Ozoneblue:
We’re talking about a parole review of a convicted criminal. This is not confidential information between you and a private doctor. It’s the official prison doctor’s verdict of an official, state sponsored medical check-up.
Surely, there’s a world of a difference between private doctor-patient confidentiality and a medical check-up for the specific purpose of parole review?
As usual garg you just don’t know what you are talking about. You and chris blah blah blah all damn day, never saying anything of substance or that can be verified with references or by logical deduction. Every blog needs its resident village idiot and this one seems too be blessed with two.
ozoneblue // Mar 6, 2009 at 2:14 pm
aahh shame are you throwing a trantrum again?
“As usual garg you just don’t know what you are talking about”
Yeh no it must be tough being you Ozoneblue like i said your the most prolific Legal Eagel this country NO wait the entire world has ever known with your sharp grace of a mind and your theories on the markets and investors was without a doubt the most ground braking article the world has ever witnessed. You my friend have a gift NO NO you have a gift…Your legal Knowledge is godly and we the peasents and mere mortals bow down to such an individual not to mention medical background and actual sound knowledge on AIDS was insightful, we are simply not worthy, I only wish i could of got my law degree from you, your name is praised in the US, why do you think I came to South Africa?
“Every blog needs its resident village idiot and this one seems too be blessed with two”.
Dont flatter yourself that prestigeous honour belongs to you
You need to get laid more often your to hyper sensitive
Dude, it’s unconstitutional because PDV says so hardly serves to separate you from the idiocy you are so keen to point out.
Except that the constitution has 2 secions, namely Section 32 (Access to Information) and Section 36 (Limiation of Rights).
According to Section 32, it is in fact unconstitutional to deny us the knowledge of the nature of Shaik’s medical parole. But Shaik has rights too, right? Well, yes. Except that Shaik is a convicted criminal, meaning the ordinary human rights as it applies to ordinary citizens do not apply to Shaik. In this case, Shaik has limited constitutional rights as lain out in Section 36.
It thus becomes obvious that descriptions such as gravely ill, which amounts to anecdotal evidence from subjective parties, are insufficient and too restrictive to make known the reasons for Shaik’s medical parole.
When one realises that Shaik is already in a position where is rights are reasonably and justifiably restricted (namely imprisoned, DUH!) one simply can not claim that an ordinary doctor-patient confidentiality rule applies.
This, coupled with your and my constitutional right to know any information held by the state, means that you and I do in fact have the right to know everything about Shaik’s medical parole that Ngconde Balfour knows.
What is more is that there are other human beings at stake here, namely those who are suffering from far worse and far more grave conditions than high blood pressure and guilt gnawing away at their conscience. It thus becomes doubly justifiable to infringe on this privacy right of Shaik.
If the village idiot can understand this, how is it that you cannot?
Garg Unzola // Mar 6, 2009 at 3:22 pm
I think that was a bit to advance for him, watch him side track your argument, drop his lipstick again and start throwing a pedantic fit
I’ve figured it out…there will be no answers forthcoming because this is clearly an issue of national security.
http://www.sokwanele.com/thisiszimbabwe/archives/3548
Smelling a rat
Wessel van Rensburg (AKA mhambi) @ 9:27 pm
Oh I’m smelling that rat too. Mugabe, the ANC, Zuma, Shaik ,the minister of correctional services , the parole board, the IEC, the black ignorant masses of Africa – they are all in on too. And now those crafty bastards are starting to rig the elections too.
“ANC in EC by-election rout
2009/03/06
THE African National Congress reaffirmed its dominance of the Eastern Cape with a clean sweep in all contested wards in municipal by-elections on Wednesday.
In the face of a challenge from the breakaway Congress of the People, the ANC won all the eight wards in Nelson Mandela Metro (Port Elizabeth) and one in Mhlontlo (Tsolo) with a massive margin of victory that debunked the view that the party was under threat from Cope.
The victory is even sweeter for the ruling party as eight of the nine seats were vacated by councillors who left the ANC to join Cope.”
http://www.dispatch.co.za/article.aspx?id=299014
http://images.sundaytimes.co.za/7/58/0000175888.jpg
This is a brotherly piece from a member of the ANC, who lived through violence in the trouble-torn Thokoza fduring those bad days. I have served in the SDU’s thanks to which I am a blogger instead of a ’statistic’ somewhere in the books of forgotten history.
I am perturbed by the responses of Spuy, Khosi and especially the ANC NEC member Ishmael Malale. Their attacks on any person who writes negatively about the ANC and its leader bother me.
I have been reading the responses of these white folks and there is nothing racist and hateful about them. I read only concern and if I were Ishmael Malale, rather than throwing eggs and tomatoes at them, I would take the bricks that are thrown at us, and use them to lay a good foundation.
Here is what is worrisome:
1. Malele, as a senior member in the ANC, has failed to refute the allegations that are made by these bloggers. Failure to do this, even worse when one attacks a person instead of the substance of his or her argument, merely reinforces the veracity of their claims.
2. The call by some, like Spuy, to other white people to leave South Africa is not only tired and irresponsible; but it is foolish as well – ask Mugabe. For the last time, South Africa belongs to all who live in it; and their concerns about crime and corruption are genuine and need to be addressed not villified. Those who don’t care about South Africa will not raise concerns but will let South Africa slide down the path of destruction. So, it will be helpful to take note rather than being defensive without refuting the claims with substance.
3. I know that after the ANC wins we are going to be flooded with the “I told you so”, and other spiteful messages. Allow me to burst your bubble. These bloggers don’t say the ANC is not going to win; but they are mainly voicing their concerns about the goings on in a country they love. I am an ANC member, living abroad, and I share their sentiments. Call me anything you want, but I am one of those ANC members who were disappointed by Polokwane. The ANC in Polokwane gave us two choices both of whom should not have been running for the Presidency in the first place. Are we really that short of leaders or is there a ‘hidden’ agenda behind this?
4. It seems to me that most ANC supporters, notably khosi and Spuy, see the election as an end in itself. They will be celebrating the ANC win ad nauseam. I have news for people like them. The election is the means to end and not an end in itself. If the ANC keeps attacking people who raise concerns, rather than dealing with those concerns, then their denials will reap what they are sowing. It is indeed true that our people, resilient as they may appear to be, are not stupid. If the little unrest in Motswaledi squatter camp in Soweto a few days ago is anything to go by, then our people will not tolerate non-delivery for too long.
5. The question to the likes of Ishmael Malela is how long the ANC will take the grassroots support for granted? They have denied that the so-called xenophobia attacks had anything to do with service delivery; yet their silence about the Motswaledi camp unrest is so loud.
6. Malela, you and your ilk, may do yourselves a favour by proving us wrong. Deliver on corruption, crime and other social concerns and we won’t have anything to bitch about. Let Zuma go to court once and for all and let the courts shut us up by pronouncing him innocent. Let Shaik release the medical reports and shut us up. Of course this will be a tall order especially after his Dr. Naidoo had said that he discharged Shaik from hospital because he got better and was supposed to have gone back to prison. Reports implicate some members of the ANC in this sham. Prove these reports wrong instead of attacking us.
I write not in defence of the white bloggers, but because I love my country more than I love my organization – the ANC.
Personally, I think this liberal approach to medical privacy is over rated.
Dumisani Mkhize // Mar 8, 2009 at 5:12 pm
Respect brother.
Dennis Bloem was the first to (in his statements released in the Shaik matter) subtly introduce the idea that terminally ill – can be broken up into terminal condition or terminal disease. As Shaik’s parents died of hypertension it is probably a terminal condition in his case. Further, instead of picking on Shaik, isn’t the question now what benefits the Shaik PB decision will have for the general inmate population. Does this indicate the beginning of a policy shift? Is the “terminally ill” provision becoming “sufficiently ill to justify that X spends time with his/her family”? It was stated that an appeal to the PB was made on humanitarian grounds – perhaps again indicating the beginning of a policy shift.
In a report by DCS released in April 2007, it showed that 1.7% of our prisons are white. Therefore 98.3% are black – what can we do to address this? Perhaps medical release as one tool, to address social injustice that will otherwise go on into eternity?