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	<title>Comments on: Shock and awe at Parliament Street</title>
	<atom:link href="http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/</link>
	<description>This blog deals with political and social issues in South Africa, mostly from the perspective of Constitutional Law. Written by Pierre de Vos</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 22 May 2012 23:04:16 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Your easy peasy 1-2-3 guide to the threats to our media freedom — GrubStreet</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-34008</link>
		<dc:creator>Your easy peasy 1-2-3 guide to the threats to our media freedom — GrubStreet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Aug 2010 14:35:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-34008</guid>
		<description>[...] &amp; Guardian editor Nic Dawes’ submission on the POI Bill at the Portfolio Committee hearing. Constitutional-law expert Pierre de Vos’ analysis on the hearings. “Secrecy law threatens SA’s democratic credentials” by Fiona Forde in Business Day. “POI [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &amp; Guardian editor Nic Dawes’ submission on the POI Bill at the Portfolio Committee hearing. Constitutional-law expert Pierre de Vos’ analysis on the hearings. “Secrecy law threatens SA’s democratic credentials” by Fiona Forde in Business Day. “POI [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Brett Nortje</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-33891</link>
		<dc:creator>Brett Nortje</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Aug 2010 20:29:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-33891</guid>
		<description>Useful idiot!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Useful idiot!</p>
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		<title>By: Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-33888</link>
		<dc:creator>Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Aug 2010 20:00:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-33888</guid>
		<description>How my Bill was betrayed

DEFEND DEMOCRACY, NOT GAG IT: Former Minister of Intelligence, Ronnie Kasrils.
...
&lt;i&gt;Substantial revisions have been made to the Bill. Whereas my motivation was to reduce unnecessary classification and encourage declassification, the 2010 Bill does the opposite.

The 2008 Bill required original State classifiers to provide a written justification for each initial classification decision. This has been removed from the 2010 Bill. The purpose behind the requirement was to force classifiers to think twice before classifying information. In particular it was there to force them to apply their minds to make reasoned and rational classification decisions, which could be defended. By removing this requirement, classifiers are given an opportunity to make up reasons after the fact.&lt;/i&gt; ...

http://www.dispatch.co.za/article.aspx?id=427543</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How my Bill was betrayed</p>
<p>DEFEND DEMOCRACY, NOT GAG IT: Former Minister of Intelligence, Ronnie Kasrils.<br />
&#8230;<br />
<i>Substantial revisions have been made to the Bill. Whereas my motivation was to reduce unnecessary classification and encourage declassification, the 2010 Bill does the opposite.</p>
<p>The 2008 Bill required original State classifiers to provide a written justification for each initial classification decision. This has been removed from the 2010 Bill. The purpose behind the requirement was to force classifiers to think twice before classifying information. In particular it was there to force them to apply their minds to make reasoned and rational classification decisions, which could be defended. By removing this requirement, classifiers are given an opportunity to make up reasons after the fact.</i> &#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.dispatch.co.za/article.aspx?id=427543" rel="nofollow">http://www.dispatch.co.za/article.aspx?id=427543</a></p>
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		<title>By: Your easy peasy 1-2-3 guide to the threats to our media freedom &#124; Grubstreet</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-33779</link>
		<dc:creator>Your easy peasy 1-2-3 guide to the threats to our media freedom &#124; Grubstreet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Aug 2010 08:16:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-33779</guid>
		<description>[...] &amp; Guardian editor Nic Dawes’ submission on the POI Bill at the Portfolio Committee hearing. Constitutional-law expert Pierre de Vos’ analysis on the hearings. “Secrecy law threatens SA’s democratic credentials” by Fiona Forde in Business [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] &amp; Guardian editor Nic Dawes’ submission on the POI Bill at the Portfolio Committee hearing. Constitutional-law expert Pierre de Vos’ analysis on the hearings. “Secrecy law threatens SA’s democratic credentials” by Fiona Forde in Business [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-33010</link>
		<dc:creator>Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Aug 2010 16:10:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-33010</guid>
		<description>&quot;The Protection of Information Bill is &quot;constitutionally suspect&quot;, says the Law Society of SA.

&quot;The bill suffers from several defects which render it constitutionally suspect and which need further consideration,&quot; the LSSA said in a statement.

The society expressed concern over the bill and the ANC-proposed Media Appeals Tribunal, and their effects on media freedom.

&quot;... Each has the potential seriously to erode transparency, accountability by public officials, the public&#039;s right of access to information and media freedom.&quot;

&quot;Defects&quot; in the bill include its &quot;broad and vague&quot; definition of &quot;national interest&quot;, the threshold for classification was &quot;unacceptably low&quot;, the bill allows for the classification of commercial information held by the state and the bill fails to provide for an &quot;independent oversight mechanism&quot; to review classification decisions.

&quot;... [It] thus leaves the final decisions in this regard in the hands of state officials who may well have an interest in continuing to conceal certain information.&quot; 

http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/article590777.ece/Law-Society-concerned-about-media-freedom</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The Protection of Information Bill is &#8220;constitutionally suspect&#8221;, says the Law Society of SA.</p>
<p>&#8220;The bill suffers from several defects which render it constitutionally suspect and which need further consideration,&#8221; the LSSA said in a statement.</p>
<p>The society expressed concern over the bill and the ANC-proposed Media Appeals Tribunal, and their effects on media freedom.</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230; Each has the potential seriously to erode transparency, accountability by public officials, the public&#8217;s right of access to information and media freedom.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Defects&#8221; in the bill include its &#8220;broad and vague&#8221; definition of &#8220;national interest&#8221;, the threshold for classification was &#8220;unacceptably low&#8221;, the bill allows for the classification of commercial information held by the state and the bill fails to provide for an &#8220;independent oversight mechanism&#8221; to review classification decisions.</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230; [It] thus leaves the final decisions in this regard in the hands of state officials who may well have an interest in continuing to conceal certain information.&#8221; </p>
<p><a href="http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/article590777.ece/Law-Society-concerned-about-media-freedom" rel="nofollow">http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/article590777.ece/Law-Society-concerned-about-media-freedom</a></p>
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		<title>By: Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-32891</link>
		<dc:creator>Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Aug 2010 10:45:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-32891</guid>
		<description>Zuma wants to talk to media

2010-08-05 11:42
Michael Hamlyn, I-Net Bridge

&quot;We understand that a lot of things that have taken place currently, the Protection of Information Bill the proposal of a media tribunal, the arrest of the journalist recently, all of these things are contributing to a climate where a perception could emerge that there is a government plan to muzzle the media, but I want to make it very clear that there isn&#039;t such a plan on the part of the government.&quot;

Maseko insisted: &quot;What needs to happen is an interaction, a dialogue that needs to take place between editors, media owners and government to understand the context, to understand where government is coming from with its proposals on the table, and for government to hear the views of media owners and the editors, to find some understanding that is acceptable.

&quot;We all agree that it is unhealthy for a perception to exist that government is on a mission to actually muzzle the media in any form or shape, which is actually not true.&quot; 

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/Zuma-wants-to-talk-to-media-20100805</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Zuma wants to talk to media</p>
<p>2010-08-05 11:42<br />
Michael Hamlyn, I-Net Bridge</p>
<p>&#8220;We understand that a lot of things that have taken place currently, the Protection of Information Bill the proposal of a media tribunal, the arrest of the journalist recently, all of these things are contributing to a climate where a perception could emerge that there is a government plan to muzzle the media, but I want to make it very clear that there isn&#8217;t such a plan on the part of the government.&#8221;</p>
<p>Maseko insisted: &#8220;What needs to happen is an interaction, a dialogue that needs to take place between editors, media owners and government to understand the context, to understand where government is coming from with its proposals on the table, and for government to hear the views of media owners and the editors, to find some understanding that is acceptable.</p>
<p>&#8220;We all agree that it is unhealthy for a perception to exist that government is on a mission to actually muzzle the media in any form or shape, which is actually not true.&#8221; </p>
<p><a href="http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/Zuma-wants-to-talk-to-media-20100805" rel="nofollow">http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/Zuma-wants-to-talk-to-media-20100805</a></p>
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		<title>By: Gwebecimele</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-32698</link>
		<dc:creator>Gwebecimele</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 14:26:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-32698</guid>
		<description>@ Maggs

If my memeory serves me well, we had a gentleman who was presented in this blog as Chief Justice of Swaziland during the Hlophe debate. Well here is a taste of the kind of Justice you find in Swaziland that should be embarassing in anyones cv.


http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&amp;click_id=29&amp;art_id=iol1280841092211S241</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Maggs</p>
<p>If my memeory serves me well, we had a gentleman who was presented in this blog as Chief Justice of Swaziland during the Hlophe debate. Well here is a taste of the kind of Justice you find in Swaziland that should be embarassing in anyones cv.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&#038;click_id=29&#038;art_id=iol1280841092211S241" rel="nofollow">http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&#038;click_id=29&#038;art_id=iol1280841092211S241</a></p>
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		<title>By: Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-32649</link>
		<dc:creator>Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Aug 2010 06:28:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-32649</guid>
		<description>&quot;Blade did not use word &#039;jail&#039;
Aug 2, 2010 11:26 PM &#124; By Staff reporter
In yesterday&#039;s The Times, a story headlined &quot;Jail journalists - Nzimande&quot;, suggested that SACP leader Blade Nzimande had called for the imprisonment of journalists. ...

The headline was, therefore, derived from this interpretation, and we accept that it is misleading. We apologise.&quot;

http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/article582513.ece/Blade-did-not-use-word-jail</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Blade did not use word &#8216;jail&#8217;<br />
Aug 2, 2010 11:26 PM | By Staff reporter<br />
In yesterday&#8217;s The Times, a story headlined &#8220;Jail journalists &#8211; Nzimande&#8221;, suggested that SACP leader Blade Nzimande had called for the imprisonment of journalists. &#8230;</p>
<p>The headline was, therefore, derived from this interpretation, and we accept that it is misleading. We apologise.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/article582513.ece/Blade-did-not-use-word-jail" rel="nofollow">http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/article582513.ece/Blade-did-not-use-word-jail</a></p>
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		<title>By: Brett Nortje</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-32551</link>
		<dc:creator>Brett Nortje</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Aug 2010 08:27:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-32551</guid>
		<description>Protect property when it is so difficult to get an eviction?

&#039;Choose tenants carefully&#039; and be accused of discrimination?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Protect property when it is so difficult to get an eviction?</p>
<p>&#8216;Choose tenants carefully&#8217; and be accused of discrimination?</p>
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		<title>By: Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/shock-and-awe-at-parliament-street/#comment-32549</link>
		<dc:creator>Maggs Naidu - maggsnaidu@hotmail.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Aug 2010 08:15:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=2568#comment-32549</guid>
		<description>Zoo Keeper says:
August 2, 2010 at 9:49 am

&quot;On cutting off essential services – dude, somebody has to pay for the services. If you say the municipality cannot cut off services then nobody is going pay. Ever.&quot;

Indeed.

It may well be why it was ruled that if services are provided to a property then the property has to stand against the expenses.

The bottom line should be that the property owner has to be responsible - protect property and choose tenants carefully, neither of which is very hard to do and neither should ultimately be the responsibility of the state.

It was reported over the weekend that as many as 450 000 homes (or some big number) are soon to be repossessed - so the defaulting owners have no money, the banks attach, who should pay for the services?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Zoo Keeper says:<br />
August 2, 2010 at 9:49 am</p>
<p>&#8220;On cutting off essential services – dude, somebody has to pay for the services. If you say the municipality cannot cut off services then nobody is going pay. Ever.&#8221;</p>
<p>Indeed.</p>
<p>It may well be why it was ruled that if services are provided to a property then the property has to stand against the expenses.</p>
<p>The bottom line should be that the property owner has to be responsible &#8211; protect property and choose tenants carefully, neither of which is very hard to do and neither should ultimately be the responsibility of the state.</p>
<p>It was reported over the weekend that as many as 450 000 homes (or some big number) are soon to be repossessed &#8211; so the defaulting owners have no money, the banks attach, who should pay for the services?</p>
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