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	<title>Comments on: Thank you Dalai Lama, you have made us proud</title>
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	<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/</link>
	<description>This blog deals with political and social issues in South Africa, mostly from the perspective of Constitutional Law. Written by Pierre de Vos</description>
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		<title>By: Clara</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12766</link>
		<dc:creator>Clara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:37:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12766</guid>
		<description>Big Slipper: Google is your friend.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Big Slipper: Google is your friend.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam van den Berg</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12738</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam van den Berg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 08:12:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12738</guid>
		<description>Jirre Prof, maar jy kan darem &#039;n ding sê! What can one add -- you&#039;ve said it all.

I think the Dalai Lama Affair brings the tragic consequences of the Mbeki years into sharp focus. I hope the NPA thinks very carefully indeed before dropping charges against Z (I can no longer bring myself to utter the name). They are teetering on the brink of a cesspool. They should perhaps rather think of adding some charges relating to the tapes they claim to have -- for example charges under national security legislation.

Incidentally you made a typo -- it&#039;s &quot;c&#039;est la vie&quot; -- but the French usually say &quot;c&#039;est la guerre&quot; -- which, God forbid, could eventually be the case. Wars and civil wars are usually started by buffoons -- and the buffoons are usually the  ones to survive.

Welcome to  Zumbabwe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jirre Prof, maar jy kan darem &#8216;n ding sê! What can one add &#8212; you&#8217;ve said it all.</p>
<p>I think the Dalai Lama Affair brings the tragic consequences of the Mbeki years into sharp focus. I hope the NPA thinks very carefully indeed before dropping charges against Z (I can no longer bring myself to utter the name). They are teetering on the brink of a cesspool. They should perhaps rather think of adding some charges relating to the tapes they claim to have &#8212; for example charges under national security legislation.</p>
<p>Incidentally you made a typo &#8212; it&#8217;s &#8220;c&#8217;est la vie&#8221; &#8212; but the French usually say &#8220;c&#8217;est la guerre&#8221; &#8212; which, God forbid, could eventually be the case. Wars and civil wars are usually started by buffoons &#8212; and the buffoons are usually the  ones to survive.</p>
<p>Welcome to  Zumbabwe.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Mcdaniel</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12734</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Mcdaniel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 05:59:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12734</guid>
		<description>The only impression that the Dalai lama left was a clear and present dangour of gaps in the anti-corruption apparatus. ANC is in bed with a new whore called china who im sure does magical things with ping bong balls. Funding political parties by foreign countries is extremely dangerous and corruptable.

Ozoneblue i think u need to go back to apartheid and see what oppression feels like or having over 80 000 people slaughted in one month.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The only impression that the Dalai lama left was a clear and present dangour of gaps in the anti-corruption apparatus. ANC is in bed with a new whore called china who im sure does magical things with ping bong balls. Funding political parties by foreign countries is extremely dangerous and corruptable.</p>
<p>Ozoneblue i think u need to go back to apartheid and see what oppression feels like or having over 80 000 people slaughted in one month.</p>
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		<title>By: Mphankomo</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12733</link>
		<dc:creator>Mphankomo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Mar 2009 05:47:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12733</guid>
		<description>Prof we should also recognise that the current bench and political discourse is a product of the history of &#039;activism&#039;. Hogan was typically being an activist that she has always been.

Nicholson was also an &#039;activist&#039; during the anti-apartheid struggle and his comrades were now in power and he couldnt let go the opportunity to enter into the political discourse. The Deputy Chief Justice had to meet Gwede to iron out issues. Sometimes they have to recuse themselves because of family connections to poloticians. Others end up buying shares from investment schemes run by ABSA/Tokyo Sexwale, and he had to publicly claim that he returned the money/shares. I will not go into Hlophe.

The two women have made all of us to sit and ponder, however I am waiting for an official ANC comment on this matter. It is testing times and much will depend how the ANC responds.

Events do shape societies and the man from Tibet has left us with a very hot political potato.

Our judiciary is coming of age, I guess.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Prof we should also recognise that the current bench and political discourse is a product of the history of &#8216;activism&#8217;. Hogan was typically being an activist that she has always been.</p>
<p>Nicholson was also an &#8216;activist&#8217; during the anti-apartheid struggle and his comrades were now in power and he couldnt let go the opportunity to enter into the political discourse. The Deputy Chief Justice had to meet Gwede to iron out issues. Sometimes they have to recuse themselves because of family connections to poloticians. Others end up buying shares from investment schemes run by ABSA/Tokyo Sexwale, and he had to publicly claim that he returned the money/shares. I will not go into Hlophe.</p>
<p>The two women have made all of us to sit and ponder, however I am waiting for an official ANC comment on this matter. It is testing times and much will depend how the ANC responds.</p>
<p>Events do shape societies and the man from Tibet has left us with a very hot political potato.</p>
<p>Our judiciary is coming of age, I guess.</p>
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		<title>By: ozoneblue</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12732</link>
		<dc:creator>ozoneblue</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 22:28:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12732</guid>
		<description>The Big Slipper @ 9:24 pm

Correction:

&quot;and China is a repressive PREVIOUSLY communist state&quot; 

They should put you in a rooi-gevaar time machine and send you back to the seventies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Big Slipper @ 9:24 pm</p>
<p>Correction:</p>
<p>&#8220;and China is a repressive PREVIOUSLY communist state&#8221; </p>
<p>They should put you in a rooi-gevaar time machine and send you back to the seventies.</p>
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		<title>By: The Big Slipper</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12731</link>
		<dc:creator>The Big Slipper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:24:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12731</guid>
		<description>Eating bacon isn&#039;t exactly the same as killing the pig, although I suppose you could argue cause and effect. Do you have any backup for what you&#039;ve heard?

In any event, the man is a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, and China is a repressive communist state who blocks YouTube when people say bad things about them. Who&#039;s side do you think we should be on?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eating bacon isn&#8217;t exactly the same as killing the pig, although I suppose you could argue cause and effect. Do you have any backup for what you&#8217;ve heard?</p>
<p>In any event, the man is a Nobel Peace Prize Laureate, and China is a repressive communist state who blocks YouTube when people say bad things about them. Who&#8217;s side do you think we should be on?</p>
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		<title>By: Clara</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12729</link>
		<dc:creator>Clara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:21:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12729</guid>
		<description>&#039;His Holiness&quot;, the Dalai Lama, is a bit of a fake: Buddhists are not supposed to kill anything, yet he happily admits he is fond of bacon. Bacon!

And that&#039;s not all: I&#039;ve heard that he (He?) wants to reintroduce in a &#039;free&#039; Tibet a system where there was no advancement or education for a country of serfs, and no employment except to serve as slaves for a self-elevated priest class. But then again, if that&#039;s what the Tibetans want, fine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;His Holiness&#8221;, the Dalai Lama, is a bit of a fake: Buddhists are not supposed to kill anything, yet he happily admits he is fond of bacon. Bacon!</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s not all: I&#8217;ve heard that he (He?) wants to reintroduce in a &#8216;free&#8217; Tibet a system where there was no advancement or education for a country of serfs, and no employment except to serve as slaves for a self-elevated priest class. But then again, if that&#8217;s what the Tibetans want, fine.</p>
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		<title>By: Pierre De Vos</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12728</link>
		<dc:creator>Pierre De Vos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:58:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12728</guid>
		<description>Two issues: I am a bit torn about the comments of Justice O&#039;Reagan. During the apartheid era the judciary mostly kept its head down and hardly ever spoke out. Those who did were brave and correctly lauded. But in a democracy judges should usually not make comments on political controversial issues of the day as it may affect the credibility of the judiciary. But there may come a time where it would become ethically untenable for a judge to remain silent while immoral and even abominal actions by the government threatens the constitutional state and brave judges should then speak out. While I am outraged by this deeply immoral and potentially corrupt decision I would not have made the call that O&#039;Reagan did to speak out now. But maybe I am not brave enough. Perhaps she decided she was retiring in any case, but reluctantly I have to say I think she was unwise.

Second point: cabinet government means that when the cabinet makes a collective decision the members of the cabinet should abide by it. If they feel they cannot, they should reside. But if a policy was not adopted by CABINET, but made in smoke-filled rooms at Luthuli House a Minister does not have the same responsibility to abide by that decision. So far evidence suggest that this was not a cabinet decision, so Hogan was within her rights to criticise. 

Oh, I have a third point as well. Why are journalists not asking government spokespeople or the ANC whether the ANC had received any money from the CHinese government or anyone associated with that government like the Chinese Communist Party? If they decline to categorically state that the ANC has not received money we would know the decision was not taken in the national interest but in the interest of the ANC. It will also underline the absolute imperative for legislation delaing with party political funding. How do we know our foreign policy is not up for sale? Well, we do not, because the ANC will not reveal the sources of their funding.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Two issues: I am a bit torn about the comments of Justice O&#8217;Reagan. During the apartheid era the judciary mostly kept its head down and hardly ever spoke out. Those who did were brave and correctly lauded. But in a democracy judges should usually not make comments on political controversial issues of the day as it may affect the credibility of the judiciary. But there may come a time where it would become ethically untenable for a judge to remain silent while immoral and even abominal actions by the government threatens the constitutional state and brave judges should then speak out. While I am outraged by this deeply immoral and potentially corrupt decision I would not have made the call that O&#8217;Reagan did to speak out now. But maybe I am not brave enough. Perhaps she decided she was retiring in any case, but reluctantly I have to say I think she was unwise.</p>
<p>Second point: cabinet government means that when the cabinet makes a collective decision the members of the cabinet should abide by it. If they feel they cannot, they should reside. But if a policy was not adopted by CABINET, but made in smoke-filled rooms at Luthuli House a Minister does not have the same responsibility to abide by that decision. So far evidence suggest that this was not a cabinet decision, so Hogan was within her rights to criticise. </p>
<p>Oh, I have a third point as well. Why are journalists not asking government spokespeople or the ANC whether the ANC had received any money from the CHinese government or anyone associated with that government like the Chinese Communist Party? If they decline to categorically state that the ANC has not received money we would know the decision was not taken in the national interest but in the interest of the ANC. It will also underline the absolute imperative for legislation delaing with party political funding. How do we know our foreign policy is not up for sale? Well, we do not, because the ANC will not reveal the sources of their funding.</p>
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		<title>By: The Big Slipper</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12727</link>
		<dc:creator>The Big Slipper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:34:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12727</guid>
		<description>It is heartening to see racial and political divides being thrown aside in favour of standing up for what is right. I applaud Ms Hogan for her stand, and while I&#039;m not sure it is entirely appropriate, it is certainly a strong statement for Justice Reagan to speak publicly on the issue.

I see the relevant spokesman - his name eludes me - commented that the media attention generated was precisely the reason thay the DL&#039;s visa was not granted. If ever there was a definition for irony that has to be it.

As far as I&#039;m aware, we are the only democratic country in the world who has ever refused a Nobel Peace Laureate entry. That alone is mind-boggling. When you consider the flimsy and contradictory excuses, it gets almost laughable, if it wasn&#039;t so antithetical to everything the Constitution is built on.

Based on the government&#039;s reasoning, I suppose it would be logical to deny the British and Irish Lions visas, in case the attention is drawn away from soccer to rugby during their 2009 tour? 

It is good to see who has principles and values in government, and who doesn&#039;t though. Because that way, when the majority who vote this government back into power end up getting screwed over for another 5 years, they won&#039;t have anybody to blame but themselves.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is heartening to see racial and political divides being thrown aside in favour of standing up for what is right. I applaud Ms Hogan for her stand, and while I&#8217;m not sure it is entirely appropriate, it is certainly a strong statement for Justice Reagan to speak publicly on the issue.</p>
<p>I see the relevant spokesman &#8211; his name eludes me &#8211; commented that the media attention generated was precisely the reason thay the DL&#8217;s visa was not granted. If ever there was a definition for irony that has to be it.</p>
<p>As far as I&#8217;m aware, we are the only democratic country in the world who has ever refused a Nobel Peace Laureate entry. That alone is mind-boggling. When you consider the flimsy and contradictory excuses, it gets almost laughable, if it wasn&#8217;t so antithetical to everything the Constitution is built on.</p>
<p>Based on the government&#8217;s reasoning, I suppose it would be logical to deny the British and Irish Lions visas, in case the attention is drawn away from soccer to rugby during their 2009 tour? </p>
<p>It is good to see who has principles and values in government, and who doesn&#8217;t though. Because that way, when the majority who vote this government back into power end up getting screwed over for another 5 years, they won&#8217;t have anybody to blame but themselves.</p>
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		<title>By: Vuyo</title>
		<link>http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/thank-you-dalai-lama-you-have-made-us-proud/#comment-12725</link>
		<dc:creator>Vuyo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 12:26:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://constitutionallyspeaking.co.za/?p=889#comment-12725</guid>
		<description>FYI:

http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FYI:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html</a></p>
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