Constitutional Hill

The influence of money on politics and the media robs us of our dignity

The spat between Premier Helen Zille and The New Age newspaper about the partial bankrolling of the paper by parastatals like Telkom and Eskom and the partial bankrolling of the DA by a company associated with the owners of The New Age is great fun to watch. It’s a bit like watching WWE SmackDown on television. You know the contestants are performing their allotted roles, but you cannot avert your eyes from the gaudy performances on the screen. Pity they are not addressing the most pressing problems related to the subversive influence of public and private funds on our political process.

We all know that money can buy an election. The recent US Presidential election cost a staggering 2.5 billion dollars. If Barack Obama had not raised over 1 billion dollars for his re-election campaign, he would never have been re-elected President of the United States.

One of the most important reasons why the ANC will remain electorally dominant for some time to come, is that it can raise hundreds of millions of Rand to pay for its lavish election campaigns. With the help of its Chancellor House front company and large donations by big business (who donate money to the ANC with the expectation that it would receive large tenders or policy favours in return) the ANC has become a money-spinning machine. The DA will also continue to improve its electoral performance as its access to patronage and power in the Western Cape and various cities and towns increasingly attracts big business donors who are eager to gain tenders or policy favours from the DA-led government or to avoid harsh criticism by the DA spin machine.

Yet, both the ANC and the DA refuse to reveal who their funders are. Both parties claim to support openness and transparency. But because it is in their immediate interest to avoid openness and transparency, they are not prepared to practice what they preach. There is no way in which we can know to what extent funders influence the policies and governance practices of these parties. Did the police decide to break up the Marikana strike because of the influence of Lonmin and other mining companies who, for all we know, might have donated large sums of money to the ANC? Did it decide to end its discussions on mine nationalisation because it was going to lose an important source of funding if it alienated the mining houses?

Can the muted response of the DA to the police massacre at Marikana be attributed to their need to keep potential mining companies sweet? Are they pushing for changes to our labour laws to reward big companies who would like to fire people without having to worry about the legal protections currently afforded to workers?

We will probably never know.

But money also influences elections in another important way. Money plays a role in determining the range of news and opinion voters are exposed to. That is why it is problematic that government departments and parastatals seem to keep The New Age afloat, despite the fact that this does not make any business sense. The governing party is trying to use its power and influence as governing party to try and buy good publicity through The New Age. This seems like a bad investment, as no one knows whether anybody is actually reading the newspaper. I tried to read it, but was put off by its novel strategy of publishing only the most boring and uncontroversial copy haphazardly thrown on to the page, seemingly without the assistance of a layout artist.

Public funds are also used to subsidise the SABC, which is by far the most important source of news and opinion for the vast majority of South Africans. And as the SABC is ANC aligned, it seldom reports on (or carries opinions about) things that would threaten the hegemonic political consensus on which the ANC’s political success partly depends.

This is not to say that the private media is truly “independent” and free from the corrupting influence of money. The private media mostly make their profits (if any) by selling advertising to businesses deeply invested in the ideology of the free market. The news reports and opinions in the media might be critical of individual companies, but will seldom threaten the hegemonic interests of big business. Moreover, the private media must target the audience whom advertisers would like to sell their products to. These middle class consumers of mainstream media are often steeped in a “safe consensus”, holding self-serving “common sense” opinions about the desirable economic system and about a range of other policy issues (without always knowing that they do so).

This allows private media outlets wanting to make a profit to provide a narrow spectrum of “diverse opinion” that cleaves narrowly to the middle ground. Reporting and complaining about ANC corruption is safe because many of the high-end consumers of news want to know about this, while many business leaders are instinctively suspicious of the ANC. But how often would the media point out that the logic of the free market condemns millions of South Africans to hunger and poverty? The mainstream media will also seldom report extensively on the lives of people living in rural areas, while often depicting the poor and marginalised as dangerous, irrational and violent, welfare scroungers or as pitiful but powerless victims in need of our patronising, LeadSA-inspired sympathy and our handouts.

With some notable exceptions (City Press at its best, the Daily Maverick on the Marikana massacre), the media serves the ANC-DA consensus uncritically, providing the illusion of carrying robust exchanges of opinions and ideas, while ignoring ideas and opinions (and failing to report stuff that many real people experience every day) when this would threaten the elite consensus about what ought to be important and how South Africa should be governed.

Underlying much of the reporting and opinion published in newspapers and broadcast on television is an assumption that important political contestation only happens within and between political parties. Social movements and grassroots organisations are largely ignored. The political elites almost never engage with the leadership of such movements and the media seldom report on grassroots mobilisation by communities in the far-flung corners of South Africa – until so called “service delivery protests” flare up and violence engulf places like Ficksburg or Sasolburg. For a few days after such an event stories about “mobs on the rampage” would appear, but only in exceptional cases do we read about the circumstances (and the political currents) that motivated communities to rise up against the state.

Of course, there is nothing inherently wrong with Business Day pushing its free market agenda or choosing not to publish long interviews with local protest leaders or striking mineworkers. Neither is there anything inherently wrong with The New Age pushing an anti-DA and anti Helen Zille agenda. The problem is that even if we wanted to, we would seldom be able to access news reports and opinions that do not serve the narrow ideological interests of the elites. There is little diversity of opinion in the media in South Africa. Really, if we are presented with a world in which we only have to choose between two options: the DA’s open opportunity society or the ANC’s semi-authoritarian state capitalism, then we have not really been presented with much of a choice at all.

If, as the Constitutional Court argued in several judgments, freedom of expression is important for a democracy, partly because the robust exchange of ideas and opinions help us to seek out and even find the “truth” (or at least our version of the “truth”), and allow us to become active citizens — free to make meaningful choices about who we are, how we want to live our lives and who to vote for — then the corrosive influence of money that produces a narrow band of facts and opinions in both the public and private media in South Africa do not serve the aims of free expression, nor of deliberative democracy.

Yes, it might serve the interests of the two major political parties (albeit unevenly), and it might serve the interests of the elites and of the business community — but that is only a small section of the 50 million people who live in South Africa. This narrow ideological focus of most of the media does not effectively empower citizens to live meaningful lives in which their dignity is promoted and they are provided with the tools to make real and informed choices.

No wonder that, on paper at least, the policy differences between the DA and the ANC are often related to style more than to substance. Both parties have adopted the National Development Plan as its policy Bible. Both believe that the state should play some role in addressing the unfair and unsustainable effects of past discrimination and exclusion. Both cosy up to big business — although for internal political reasons the ANC has to be nice to organised labour while the DA can bash the unions without alienating its donors.

Instead of providing us with more choices and more information, the influence of money on political parties and the media narrows down our choices and robs us of our dignity. This is not going to change soon — no matter how much money parastatals pump into The New Age.

  • Max

    I should point out that the excellent http://www.groundup.org.za was founded in part because of the problems you point out. If you want the media to become more diverse, i suggest supporting such projects.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    “This is not to say that the private media is truly “independent” and free from the corrupting influence of money. The private media mostly make their profits (if any) by selling advertising to businesses deeply invested in the ideology of the free market. The news reports and opinions in the media might be critical of individual companies, but will seldom threaten the hegemonic interests of big business. Moreover, the private media must target the audience whom advertisers would like to sell their products to. These middle class consumers of mainstream media are often steeped in a “safe consensus”, holding self-serving “common sense” opinions about the desirable economic system and about a range of other policy issues (without always knowing that they do so).”

    Wow. Something very sensible from this man Pierre De Vos.

    Pierre, in all honesty, where does the Claude Leon Foundation stand on this one?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ Pierre

    “how often would the media point out that the logic of the free market condemns millions of South Africans to hunger and poverty?”

    Not very often. How curious that the media overlooks objective facts such as this!

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    January 31, 2013 at 23:07 pm

    You must have a very short memory or you are just obtuse as a bonobo or a baboon. Didn’t I post the objective UN verified facts on Cuba just a couple of days ago for you?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ OzoneBlue

    I did note the facts you posted about Cuba’s admirable health care, which did not surprise me. I was, however, surprised at your suggestion that the Cuban masses did not enjoy the right to vote. Of course they do — and over half a century have come out 99% for Fidel, in poll after poll! (Coicidentally perhaps, I also share 99% of my genes with the Bonobo!)

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 1, 2013 at 0:24 am

    @ OzoneBlue

    “I did note the facts you posted about Cuba’s admirable health care, which did not surprise me.”

    Oh – but it is not only health care, it is education as well. How about life expectancy, safety and security? Human happiness in general.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Robbed of our dignity!

    South Africa has gone backwards in safeguarding human rights, according to the Human Rights Watch annual world report.

    The killing of 34 miners at Marikana platinum mine, in North West, is one of the “worrisome developments” highlighted by the international human rights watchdog in its report.

    Released yesterday, the report for 2012 calls Marikana “one of the worst death tolls in violent protests since 1994″.

    The shooting not only exposed police brutality but has highlighted grave concerns about the government’s failure to fulfil basic economic and social rights.

    In the report, Human Rights Watch flays the government, trade unions and mine owner Lonmin for allowing the strike to deteriorate into a crisis.

    The report highlights:

    The threat to freedom of expression posed by the controversial Protection of State Information Bill;
    How, after establishing the Gender Commission and a women’s ministry, the government took two steps backwards by reintroducing the Traditional Courts Bill, which threatens women’s and children’s rights; and
    The state’s failure – because of corruption, financial mismanagement and poor leadership – to meet public demands for fuller realisation of their economic and social rights.

    Human Rights Watch’s South African director, Cameron Jacobs, said yesterday that, because of these and other problems, 2012 had been a year of “higher challenges” for South Africa in human rights.

    http://www.timeslive.co.za/thetimes/2013/01/31/sa-flayed-over-rights

  • Howard Klaaste

    I can attest to that. Die Burger newspaper was invited as a guest to the opening of an establishment that was illegal in every sense of the word. They sang praise and worship about this in their paper. When I put the facts to them during an interview with two of their senior journalists on different occasions, they refrained from publishing it.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 1, 2013 at 6:29 am

    “Released yesterday, the report for 2012 calls Marikana “one of the worst death tolls in violent protests since 1994″.”

    In fact to be accurate since Sharpeville 1960.

    And 1922 – massacre of over 200 militant White workers under Smuts in very similar circumstances – well that just never happened and hardly get a mention.

    Why?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    Ozoneguy, yes, I am acutely aware that Mr Castro and his brother have attained nearly an ideal state. I just wanted to stress that this had contributed to 99.99999999999999 support for the Communist party in some many elections! Liberals may scoff, but that is how grateful the electorate becomes if you give them PARADISE on earth!

  • Gwebecimele

    Chapter 9 institution boss sorted by thugs!!! How is that for Independence.

    http://mg.co.za/article/2013-02-01-00-icasa-councillor-taken-on-hell-ride

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 1, 2013 at 9:49 am

    I’m not a “liberal” mfd. Your bad jokes I do not find them funny.

  • Gwebecimele
  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    Blue Ozone, I too am no liberal, so I know how hurtful it is to be called one. (When I worked in the Caribbean, I was known to most as a “FIDELISTA”)

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 1, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    I was known to most as a “FIDELISTA”

    really? Was it Fidel, Che (or perhaps the ghost of Karl Marx) that brainwashed you into blaming every problem in the world on “whiteness” and white people.

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ OzoneBlue

    For the zillioneth time, the abstract noun form is WHITISHNESS!

    Thanks

  • Brett Nortje

    Since most of the ANC leadership and the huge majority of its supporters are functionally illiterate should we not be looking at money-laundering as the probable reason why it is pouring money into the print media?

  • Gwebecimele
  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje
    February 1, 2013 at 13:33 pm

    Hey G,

    Happy Friday.

    The ANC government has indeed failed.

    It has failed to make WHITE people as poor as everyone else!

    WDYSTT?

    Inequality of income in South Africa and the number of people living in poverty have been reduced significantly since 2005.

    But white people continue to earn the most and own the most assets, according to research by the South African Institute of Race Relations.

    A measure of the increase in income can be seen in the growth of people who fall into the living standards measure (LSM) 5 to 8, and the reduction in numbers in the lower LSM 1 to 4 in the past three years.

    When it comes to average household income per province, the Western Cape leads, followed by Gauteng. But perhaps more significantly, the Northern Cape, Limpopo and the Free State saw the highest percentage increase in income from 1996 to 2011.

    About 37% of the population is living below the poverty line and, although this has been reduced substantially since 1996, 44.6% of these are black, 26.7% coloured, 10.9% Indian and 0.6% white.

    http://mg.co.za/article/2013-01-25-white-people-still-earn-the-most

    p.s. Now let’s see 44.6 + 26.7 + 10.9 + 0.6 = 100!!!!

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Gwebecimele
    February 1, 2013 at 14:39 pm

    I think it was clear from the start this was just another cheap political propaganda stunt. More or less the same with Nkandla.

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ Maggs

    “[Govt] has failed to make WHITE people as poor as everyone else!”

    With respect, you are wrong. Overall, BLACKS are richer than whites. Take into account that most of SA’s billionaires are black. 500,000 poor whites live in Coronationville. Many whites cannot get jobs anymore, and must pay for their private Model C Schools. The black middle class is larger than the white middle class. Look at all the white “car guards.” Blacks get billions in free grants. Patrick Motsepe has money to burn.

    Confused? OzoneBlueGuy will explain!

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 1, 2013 at 14:58 pm

    Interesting to note that according to SAIRR, that great neo-Apartheid think-tank, Indians and Coloureds are not black any more?

    “About 37% of the population is living below the poverty line and, although this has been reduced substantially since 1996, 44.6% of these are black, 26.7% coloured, 10.9% Indian and 0.6% white.”

    Or is other words there are now 1.2 million poor whites in a population of 4.5 mil or around 25%.

    Still not good enough?

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 1, 2013 at 15:20 pm

    “The black middle class is larger than the white middle class.”

    Correct 7/10 of the SA middle + upper class is black. There are many stats to prove that fact.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Blue Ozone
    February 1, 2013 at 15:48 pm

    Ozone Boy,

    “The black middle class is larger than the white middle class.”

    Dworky is being dull.

    The Black middle class is 100% Black!

    WDYSTT?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    Reactionary Zimbawean insults our people and their staunch electoral choice:

    http://www.politicsweb.co.za/politicsweb/view/politicsweb/en/page71619?oid=354466&sn=Detail&pid=71616

  • Brett Nortje

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com) says:
    February 1, 2013 at 14:58 pm

    Dear Maggot

    It is never a happy day under ANC rule.

    Thank you.

    P.s. Do you know what ‘relevant’ means?

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje
    February 1, 2013 at 19:47 pm

    G,

    “P.s. Do you know what ‘relevant’ means?”

    Hmmm – that a tough one.

    Would it be relevant to say that 0.6% of 37% being poor is an indication of how “(t)he influence of money on politics and the media robs us of our dignity”?

    p.s. as an aside I’m wondering if the SAIRR people studied maths at a Limpopo High School!

  • Brett Nortje

    Maggs, please do not attempt to deflect with humour.

    And for Heaven’s sake do not look up ‘relevant’ in a dictionary. Cde Blade would not like that. He very specifically eschews dictionary meanings, if you read Gareth van Onselen’s article.

    Be like Cde Mthethwa, who had a benefactor build a security wall around his house, without noticing it.

    Really, Cde Maggs, the faith you ANC louts have in the printed word is really apparent in the enthusiasm you show distributing school textbooks.

    Evidently, the ANC are great conservationists. Except Mandelas. They love stealing and wasting Mandelas at places like the SABC. Perhaps they think that if they make Mandelas disappear they go for good.

  • Brett Nortje

    BTW, tomorrow is the final of the Million Dollar pigeon race so I will not be entertaining background noise from you for the weekend.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 1, 2013 at 19:58 pm

    “p.s. as an aside I’m wondering if the SAIRR people studied maths at a Limpopo High School!”

    Well, if you would indulge me. Using 50 mil as base population figure and noting Indians are 2.5% of total population i.e. 2.8/100 x 50 = 1.4 mil indians in SA.

    You agree?

    Now take 37% of population are poor and 10.9% purportedly indian i.e. 37/100 x 10.9/100 x 50 = 2 mil indians are poor.

    I.E. there are more poor indians in SA than there are indians or 140% of Indians are poor – I smell either bullshit or an Indian statistician trying to grossly exaggerate Indian backwardness.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    …are 2.8% of total population i.e. 2.8/100 x 50 = 1.4 mil indians in SA…

    corrected.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Blue Ozone
    February 1, 2013 at 20:36 pm

    LOL Ozone Boy.

    Well spotted.

    Since there are more poor Indians than living ones it just goes to show that coolies never die – we just become poor!

    p.s. So the M&G cannot be trusted – Comrade President Professor Zuma may be onto something there!

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 1, 2013 at 20:55 pm

    “p.s. So the M&G cannot be trusted – Comrade President Professor Zuma may be onto something there!”

    I’m sure you are aware there was a journalist named Ivor Powell ( a drunk and a a washout, real CCB material) who worked at M&G. then he moved to the NPA under Bulelani and may have been the source who was continually “leaking” confidential info into the press during those investigations. Such leaks continually undermined the NPA because of all the “trail by media” innuendo and the enormous victimhood of JZ. I.E. if it was not for Powell/ M&G/PdV axis of evil JZ could have found himself in the tjoekie today, or playing golf with Shabir on poor Jackie Selebi’s grave.

    British Imperialism->M&G->Zuma->Lonmin_Menell/Ramaphosa->future ANC president. Guess who wins?

    Am I making any sense?

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Blue Ozone
    February 1, 2013 at 21:55 pm

    Hey Ozone Boy,

    “Am I making any sense?”

    Don’t push it – one swallow does not make a summer!

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ BluishGuy

    “British Imperialism->M&G->Zuma->Lonmin_Menell/Ramaphosa->future ANC president.”

    True. But try this:

    Jesus Christ>St Paul>Constantine>Pope Leo IV>Dominican Order>Martin Luther>Dutch Protestants>East India Company>Simon van der Stel>Stellenbosch University>BROEDEBOND>PdV>Constitutionally Speaking!

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Capitalism: A Ghost Story

    Rockefeller to Mandela, Vedanta to Anna Hazare…. How long can the cardinals of corporate gospel buy up our protests?

    Arundhati Roy

    Is it a house or a home? A temple to the new India, or a warehouse for its ghosts? Ever since Antilla arrived on Altamont Road in Mumbai, exuding mystery and quiet menace, things have not been the same. “Here we are,” the friend who took me there said, “Pay your respects to our new Ruler.”

    Antilla belongs to India’s richest man, Mukesh Ambani. I had read about this most expensive dwelling ever built, the twenty-seven floors, three helipads, nine lifts, hanging gardens, ballrooms, weather rooms, gymnasiums, six floors of parking, and the six hundred servants. Nothing had prepared me for the vertical lawn—a soaring, 27-storey-high wall of grass attached to a vast metal grid. The grass was dry in patches; bits had fallen off in neat rectangles. Clearly, Trickledown hadn’t worked.

    But Gush-Up certainly has. That’s why in a nation of 1.2 billion, India’s 100 richest people own assets equivalent to one-fourth of the GDP.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qv8l9AKZanQ

    http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?280234

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    A similar coup was carried out in the anti-apartheid struggle in South Africa. In 1978, the Rockefeller Foundation organised a Study Commission on US Policy toward Southern Africa. The report warned of the growing influence of the Soviet Union on the African National Congress (ANC) and said that US strategic and corporate interests (i.e., access to South Africa’s minerals) would be best served if there were genuine sharing of political power by all races.

    The foundations began to support the ANC. The ANC soon turned on the more radical organisations like Steve Biko’s Black Consciousness movement and more or less eliminated them. When Nelson Mandela took over as South Africa’s first Black President, he was canonised as a living saint, not just because he was a freedom fighter who spent 27 years in prison, but also because he deferred completely to the Washington Consensus. Socialism disappeared from the ANC’s agenda. South Africa’s great “peaceful transition”, so praised and lauded, meant no land reforms, no demands for reparation, no nationalisation of South Africa’s mines. Instead, there was Privatisation and Structural Adjustment. Mandela gave South Africa’s highest civilian award—the Order of Good Hope—to his old supporter and friend General Suharto, the killer of Communists in Indonesia. Today, in South Africa, a clutch of Mercedes-driving former radicals and trade unionists rule the country. But that is more than enough to perpetuate the illusion of Black Liberation.

    http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?280234

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 2, 2013 at 8:53 am

    Yikes maggs. You are beginning to sound like me. Perhaps you want to start a satellite blog about the appalling dangerous of family life in India?

    So many questions.

    Do you think Ricky Menell, Patrice Motsepe, Cyril Ramaphosa and the CLF would ever approve of such an illusion of [BLACK] liberation? Do you think Karl Marx/Che/Fidel would want ALL people to be free, not only Blacks but Whites, Coloureds and Indians too?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ OB

    “Do you think . . . Che/Fidel would want ALL people to be free”

    No.

    Although, like you, I greatly admire Fidel, darker-skinned Cubans have been, shall we say, “under represented” in the ruling elite since 1959.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Blue Ozone
    February 2, 2013 at 10:16 am

    Bluetish Guy (Thanks Dworky),

    “Do you think Karl Marx/Che/Fidel would want ALL people to be free, not only Blacks but Whites, Coloureds and Indians too?”

    It’s always important to reflect on what dead (or nearly dead) people would want.

    It’s as important and significant as quoting people who quote people.

    p.s. So when Fidel is finally no more will he become “Infidel”?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    Maggs, Arundhati is very pretty, and seems to know a lot about the world. But I always find her writings a bit of a “downer.” Can’t she find something good to say about anything?

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 2, 2013 at 11:05 am

    “Although, like you, I greatly admire Fidel, darker-skinned Cubans have been, shall we say, “under represented” in the ruling elite since 1959.”

    I believe that you are implying that the “ruling elite” in Cuba are racist? I would say that is highly unlikely given the fact that the Cuban people lead by that “racist” elite have sacrificed a great deal over the past couple of decades to liberate Africa form White minority rule.

    May I suggest you take your divisive race obsessed politics imported from the capitalist USA where inequality is the worst in the world and shove it up your ass?

  • Michael Osborne

    @ Blue Ozone

    As far as I know, the figures do show that “black” Cubans (more than 60% of the population), are indeed greatly disadvantaged:

    • Blacks in Senior Leadership (Politburo) of the Cuban Communist Party: 17 %

    • Blacks in Executive Committee (Secretariat) of the Cuban Communist Party: 4 %

    If you have different figures, please share.

    See:

    Partido Comunista de Cuba, “Buró Político,” (http://www.pcc.cu/estructura_organizacion/buro_politico/buro_politico.html.);(Partido Comunista de Cuba, “Integrantes del Secretariado del Comité Central,” http://www.pcc.cu/estructura_organizacion/secretariado/secretariado.html.
)

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Michael Osborne
    February 2, 2013 at 16:25 pm

    I’m trying to understand the racist logic behind your reasoning where “black” becomes a separate “identity” of some sorts that should be acknowledged and reflected in all demographics .

    So are you saying those demographics in Cuba are as they are because the Cuban people are racist despite their massive contributions to African liberation. Using the same logic with reference to “Jews” or “Asians” in USA, are they also over-represented because of some racist White conspiracy against them?

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    This is the kind of racism that is continuously exported from the USA and then packaged as some kind of liberal or progressive ideology. Apparently, according to MRGI Cubans did a bad in “classifying” themselves during the revolution. They should have followed in the footsteps of Verwoerd in the spirit of Apartheid.

    “The 2002 census figures supplied by the government claim that 65% of Cubans were white.[1] The Institute for Cuban and Cuban-American Studies at the University of Miami says 68% are black.[1] The Minority Rights Group International says that “An objective assessment of the situation of Afro-Cubans remains problematic due to scant records and a paucity of systematic studies both pre- and post-revolution. Estimates of the percentage of people of African descent in the Cuban population vary enormously, ranging from 33.9 per cent to 62 per cent”. It uses the number for 51% for mulattoes.[2][3]”

    http://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/Demographics_of_Cuba.html

  • Brett Nortje

    Watse “massive contribution”?

    Is jy gesuip?

    Blue Ozone says:
    February 2, 2013 at 17:27 pm

    “So are you saying those demographics in Cuba are as they are because the Cuban people are racist despite their massive contributions to African liberation”

  • Michael Osborne

    @ OB

    “I’m trying to understand the racist logic behind your reasoning where “black” becomes a separate “identity” of some sorts that should be acknowledged and reflected in all demographics .”

    You may be surprised that I agree with you that there is a danger that, in focussing on racially-defined categories, we end up reifying the very divisions that non-racialism is supposed to overcome. (PdV noted this irony in one of his recent postings.)

    That being said, do you not think that there must be some role for racially-defined statistics when identifying actual racism in the first instance? After all, one of the ways we understand the practical impact of racism in pre-1994 SA is by looking at figures on income distribution, school attendance, etc. You mention racism in the U.S. One of the markers thereof is statistical – e.g. the stark over-representation of blacks in the prison population. It turns out that Cuban “blacks” (and I agree with you that there are definitional problems), are also over-represented in Cuban prisons. May we not take note of that, if it is true?

  • sirjay jonson

    I think some of you folks should visit Cuba to actually experience the levels of oppression, gov’t corruption, poverty, lack of opportunity, restrictions on travel, and yes general malaise and unhappiness.

    When they run out of milk by the way, which happens, they serve the people ice-cream. If Cuba is a paradise then SA is a pristine, violence free, corruption free (d)emocracy.

  • Brett Nortje

    I would like to visit Cuba. Love one of their little horses. Watch baseball all day. Other sporting pursuits.

  • sirjay jonson

    As for you comments on the DA, Prof, as though their behavior is even closely similar to the ANC, as exemplified by “Pity they are not addressing the most pressing problems related to the subversive influence of public and private funds on our political process” I fail to see how you can not recognize that the issue you refer to is exactly what Zille is trying to address.

    Its not just “a lot of black South Africans are in denial of what is coming around the corner” as expressed by Vince Musewe, its also the failure of some who should know better. http://www.politicsweb.co.za/politicsweb/view/politicsweb/en/page71619?oid=354466&sn=Detail

    The adage that we don’t know what we have until we lose it, applies to various matters in SA, and includes failing to recognize well intentioned politicians.

    Seek the seed from the chaff.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje
    February 2, 2013 at 20:09 pm

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ Sirjay

    Perhaps you are not aware that the DA is responsible for a sea of corruption in the Western Cape that makes the ANC look like a paragon of virtue by comparison. Perhaps you are also not aware that one loses all credibility as a critic of ANC corruption unless one makes periodic sideswipes at the DA!

    Thanks.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Michael Osborne
    February 2, 2013 at 19:59 pm

    “After all, one of the ways we understand the practical impact of racism in pre-1994 SA is by looking at figures on income distribution, school attendance, etc.”

    Yes. Given South Africa’s apartheid history we certainly did need race-based affirmative action. I supported it for long enough. But it seems to be asking questions only about intra-class race “demographics” but not asking any questions about inter-class distribution of wealth. I said a couple of times AA/BEE is close to the point of reaching its “redistribution” objectives.

    What now? This issue cannot be avoided any more.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett you twit – did your duck win it’s race?

  • sirjay jonson

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 2, 2013 at 23:12 pm

    With apologies to the Prof, I well recognize your point Fass, the need to keep the balance especially for all those hidden mice with malevolent minds. However this present article is more than a tad misleading.

    For a more nuanced response see http://www.politicsweb.co.za/politicsweb/view/politicsweb/en/page71619?oid=354862&sn=Detail&pid=71616

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    sirjay jonson
    February 3, 2013 at 7:53 am

    Sirjay,

    “For a more nuanced response see …”

    That’s not a nuanced response.

    It’s idiotic!

  • Michael Osborne

    @ Blue Ozone

    “Given South Africa’s apartheid history we certainly did need race-based affirmative action.”

    Here we agree. But our debate as I understand it was not directly on that point. It was whether one could take into account “race”, however roughly defined, to determine whether or not there are patterns of racial exclusion in a society. To return to my earlier point: the fact that people with darker skins are grossly over-represented in prisons in SA, US and Cuba offers at least a clue as to patterns of racially-based subordination in those three societies, does it not?

  • Mickhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ Maggs (to Brett)

    “did your duck win it’s race?”

    Brett races guinea-fowl – not ducks. But apropos that, did I mention that Matilda won 450,000 kropjne ($500), in a “friendly” last year?

  • Alibama

    }..the logic of the free market condemns millions of South Africans
    } to hunger and poverty?
    How did your Julius-Nyrere-socialism compare,
    or ANY alternative that you can
    mention? BTW. medical conditions caused by
    OBESITY are exploding in SA.
    ====
    Newsgroups: za.politics
    Subject: Pallo Jordan’s poor reasoning

    http://www.bdlive.co.za/opinion/columnists/2013/01/17/
    will-anc-now-right-the-wrongs-of-stolen-land

    Pallo Jordan ANC-spin-doctor wrote:-
    ] After the frontier wars that resulted in the systematic
    ] expropriation of the indigenous people’s land, the Natives Land Act
    ] is probably the most deeply felt grievance among blacks. While the
    ] wars had all ended with whites seizing African land, by legislative
    ] fiat, the 1913 law excluded the possibility of blacks ever
    ] reacquiring it on the open market, for example. There could be no
    ] clearer indication that the white minority had taken the land as the
    ] spoils of conquest.
    ——–
    No, the LAW prohibiting land sale to the natives was to enforce
    geographical separation: APARTHEID. The current native-robber-gangs
    do not prohibit members from selling their loot ‘on the open market’.

    There’s NO relationship between an asset being ‘the spoils of conquest’
    and the permission to sell it, unless you’re thinking of keeping stolen
    [uniquly identifyable] items hidden from law enforcement.

    ‘Law excluding the possibility of’ one company acquiring another
    company is often based on preventing MONOPOLISTIC practices.

    This, like apartheid is a HIGHER reason that looting.

    The Afrikaaners’ situation was directly comparable with the Israelis’:
    wanting to have a JEWISH state.

    Only the settlers unrealistic hope that they could stay, caused them to
    call themselves Afrikaaners, and design the APARTHEID system.
    They didn’t know that it wouldn’t last. And many are still in denial
    that they must leave.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Michael Osborne
    February 3, 2013 at 9:35 am

    Hmmm!

    “people with darker skins are grossly over-represented in prisons”

  • Brett Nortje

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com) says:
    February 3, 2013 at 6:22 am

    Maggs, do you think I have $1000 to enter a pigeon race? Have you ever heard of the City of Johannesburg (which has just ‘managed’ another qualified audit?)

    No, I am consigned to the bleachers to participate vicariously in friend’s columbophilic exploits….

  • Brett Nortje

    Sirjay, Pierre sees the writing on the wall.

    He has just painted himself into a corner which he doesn’t know how to get out of. Great pity, because ….ag, I’ve told you what role I saw for him.

    Personally, it is beyond me how some men cannot admit when they were wrong.

  • http://medialternatives.com David Robert Lewis

    The problem of sponsor representation at boardroom level affecting the media doesn’t end with the Guptas. Independent Group were implicated in a massive public relations fraud involving Clear Channel and public relations firms. Maharaj is or was director of Clear Channel Independent. The Mulroney Scandal and other scandals involving “brown envelopes” have all played out. Media24 are another example where the financial services secfor owns an enormous stake affecting editorial decisions, Wilmott James was a director at Media24 for a number of years, and so the problem of political influence and affluence continues to manifest as distinctions between the media and political parties become non-existent and both echelons of society are bankrolled by financial interests.

  • Alibama

    Re. Pallo Jordan’s spin doctoring:-
    Years ago, I read about the ox-cart-loads of produce being brought to market by
    the ‘african’ farmers, before apartheid killed their productivety, and I
    believed it. But now I’m asking myself: WHERE have ‘they’ shown such productivety
    EVER: from PE to Haiti; and why do ‘my people’ [donors] always have to feed them?
    I hate myself when I realise that I’ve allowed my self to be fooled — again.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Michael Osborne
    February 3, 2013 at 9:35 am

    “To return to my earlier point: the fact that people with darker skins are grossly over-represented in prisons in SA, US and Cuba offers at least a clue as to patterns of racially-based subordination in those three societies, does it not?”

    Do Indians also have darker skins or not? What about the pattern indicating they are “under represented” in prisons in SA, US and Cuba and “overrepresented” in position of power as well? Why does your entire “race theory” go to shit when I start talking about the pattern of Jewish “over-representation” in position of power all over the planet, besides the Middle East. Perhaps in the Middle East they are under-represented because of White Supremacy or would that be Black Supremacy or Arab Supremacy or WTF? And forget about the Mullattos, and the Pardos and the Coloureds not to mention the Chinese – how do they fit into these “patterns of race-based subjugation”? It is necessary for them all to be arbitrary “classified” to fit into your “patterns” – is it not?

    Isn’t there a more consistent and logical explanation for most of all the phenomena above where you look for “race” as THE smoking gun that has to do with socio-economic development and class based oppression. I.E. – what percentage of people in USA, Cuba and SA jails are from the middle/upper classes and what percentage are descendants of slaves?

  • Brett Nortje

    Yes, Maggs! What are you going to do about the underrepresentation of Indians in our prisons?

  • Brett Nortje
  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Alibama
    February 3, 2013 at 9:39 am

    “Only the settlers unrealistic hope that they could stay, caused them to
    call themselves Afrikaaners, and design the APARTHEID system.
    They didn’t know that it wouldn’t last. *And many are still in denial
    that they must leave.*”

    According to Andile Mngxitama – or face the inevitable apocalypse of Black revenge.

    “To end racism, actually, would be to realise the Armageddon that those whites Schutte derides for being paranoid know awaits in some historical corner. It can’t be otherwise, given the magnitude of historical transgression against blacks. The coming apocalypse was best described in JM Coetzee’s Disgrace. To his credit Coetzee left the country because he knows, like Lucy in the novel, that whites have to start from the beginning with nothing – like dogs. This kind of thinking offends liberals like Schutte, who just want a little bit of acknowledgment.”

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Brett Nortje
    February 3, 2013 at 10:52 am

    “Yes, Maggs! What are you going to do about the underrepresentation of Indians in our prisons?”

    Not to mention our national soccer and rugby squads. They somehow made it into the Proteas though, despite this vast pattern of white racial subjugation as measured by the logic of the demographics. Could there possibly be any any other cultural factors involved like for example – that traditionally Indians don’t like soccer or rugby and therefore not much bothered at all?

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje
    February 3, 2013 at 10:52 am

    Brett,

    “Yes, Maggs! What are you going to do about the underrepresentation of Indians in our prisons?”

    I’m really not sure how we could make prison population more “representative” as Prof MO hints at – perhaps there could be weekly quotas for magistrates and judges using our AA/EE score cards perhaps?

    Anyway, you should know by now that prisons are mainly for poor people or those who fall foul of leading politicians.

    The one lot don’t have the interests of lawyers the other of politicians.

    As we say back in Coolieland “if you have your bread buttered on both sides, don’t let it fall” – I dunno what that means but it sounds nice.

    WDYS?

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Blue Ozone
    February 3, 2013 at 11:05 am

    Blue Boy,

    “Not to mention our national soccer and rugby squads.”

    We have to leave some space for WHITE people – just so that you okes will buy our bunny chows and love it!

  • Brett Nortje

    Andile is a silly doos. A fantasist. Thanks to his ‘blackness’ he has been shielded by ‘progressives’ from a lot of the ‘cut and thrust of robust debate’ that was aimed at encouraging intellectual rigour in the thinking of the rest of us who had a normal university experience.

    He accepts the ANC rewrite of history and existential myths without reservation.

    Andile sees a victorious outcome (for his side) black diamonds still with Pajeros in their driveways, old age pensions at the end of the month for black grannies, their daugters with child-grants in hand as the outcome of race war.

    It is called ‘cognitive dissonance’, this kind of disconnect.

    The truth is the reality of the outcome will be completely different from his fantasies.

    Here is the crux: Do you think Andile sou voete gestamp het vir 2 jaar vir R150 ‘n maand?

    OBS, you’rre rapidly pissing me off with your imprecise use of language. Do you think it will mean hardship for you to differentiate between ‘attempted’ and ‘completed’ genocide?

  • Brett Nortje

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com) says:
    February 3, 2013 at 11:31 am

    I say the spirit of voluntarism is sadly lacking in one Maggs J Naidu…

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje
    February 3, 2013 at 11:38 am

    Hayibo G,

    Are you suggesting that I should volunteer to break out the “grossly over-represented darker skins”.

    That’s illegal.

    As a good, unrighteous, god-fearing citizen it is beyond my conscience to do that.

    Anyway – I’ve got other things to do this weekend.

  • Brett Nortje

    No, what I’m suggesting is that you have yourself voluntarily incarcerated….

    Ignore it if you hear the people helping you at the counter say ‘commital’ a lot – it is just mindless legalese. Insist that that is what you want, to up the representivity of Indians.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje
    February 3, 2013 at 11:55 am

    G,

    The prisons are over crowded + they only serve WHITE people’s food – boiled everything.

    And with the NPA now bankrupt they won’t want to prosecute a nice guy like me or anyone else for the next year – Juju is an exception as he meets the “criteria”.

    http://www.citypress.co.za/news/cash-crisis-in-npa/

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Brett Nortje
    February 3, 2013 at 11:36 am

    Truth is Andile needs people like you to fuel his own genocidal, racist ideology. And there is plenty of fuel in South Africa, he thrives in that environment. It is a simple strategy of polarization, happens for example in Israel too. Two radical extremes, none of which are representative of the ideology or thinking of the common man in the street are played off against each other to maintain the status quo, consisting of a recursive pattern of retribution and revenge that makes reconciliation and a political solution impossible. The society is torn apart and dictated to by the extremes. But who is benefiting the most from such a state of affairs, who has taken control of the oil fields in Iraq when the “War on Terror” has just by devastated the county and its people.

    “U.S.troops may have left Iraq, but international oil and gas companies can’t help themselves. There’s too much opportunity around to not get involved in the action.

    That’s why Exxon Mobil, Chevron, France’s Total S.A. and many others are in Iraq producing oil and natural gas as I write.”

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Really why waste more time. Just simply say that the Constitutional Court should impose hard quotas. What is the point of a list that includes male candidates when the political pressure is so overwhelming to elect a female.

    Lets just accept that men cannot show any empathy with women issues, just as whites cannot have any empathy with blacks. We are a bunch of Neanderthals who somehow managed to become judges but our inborn prejudice remain impossible to overcome. The Constitution will regulate our morality and our human interaction we cannot transcend the crude barriers of our own constructed “identities”.

    http://www.citypress.co.za/politics/yacoob-asks-zuma-to-appoint-women/

  • Dmwangi

    “Lets just accept that men cannot show any empathy with women issues, just as whites cannot have any empathy with blacks. We are a bunch of Neanderthals who somehow managed to become judges but our inborn prejudice remain impossible to overcome.”

    Quite right, OB. Recall where SA’s foremost jurist stated with finality that whites cannot escape the ‘virus’ of racism that pumps through their veins. Can’t see how virology is a social construct– though am PdV will explain.

    Re: money in politics, what is 2.5b/16.5t? Probably not enough to buy election to the highest office. But of course, PdV can state in perfect scholarly form, with copious evidence: “If Barack Obama had not raised over 1 billion dollars for his re-election campaign, he would never have been re-elected President of the United States.” I stand in awe of his judicious even-handedness and meticulous, painstaking interrogations of his most firmly held positions. Praise Maggs we have such fine jurists in this country.

  • SkyLukeWater

    Lets legalize marijuana.

    Just imagine a much more docile, uneducated voter-base who are more chilled out, and less greedy.

    Think of all the health benefits and – as a result – a lowered burden on our under-resourced public health system because of all the health benefits. Just think of all the possibilities! We could all write our own futures with some Transkei-Gold space-cabbage without the paranoia of getting busted …. :D

    It also creates a new revenue stream for political sponsoring …

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Dmwangi
    February 3, 2013 at 17:42 pm

    Hey DM,

    Welcome back – you really should have let us know you were around.

    Your post finally makes a lot of sense. It must have taken a lot of thought to put together.

    p.s. I lie – you sound drunk and silly!

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ OzoneGuy

    “Just simply say that the Constitutional Court should impose hard quotas.”

    OG is right.

    There is already a gross demographic imbalance on the Court.

    Thanks.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 3, 2013 at 22:13 pm

    “There is already a gross demographic imbalance on the Court.”

    Besides for race, gender and sexual orientation I have also noted a gross imbalance in representation of short and obese people. It has been proven that short and obese people are systematically discriminated against through the centuries.

    “If you are not buying into my stories of woe, I found several articles, including one from CBS News by Lloyd de Vries entitled “The Trouble With Tall People.” In this piece, de Vries notes that the average height of a man in the United States is 5’9″ and of a woman is 5’4″. Any height below these heights, he explains, “comes up short.” Ha. Ha. Ha. Anyway, according to the article, a recent University of North Carolina study shows that short people are being discriminated against financially. According to statistics, “the taller you are, the more money you make. Each inch is worth about $789 more per year.” Tall people, on average, earn several thousand dollars more each year than an equally qualified, same gender, shorter person. The study also finds that tall people also “get better job evaluations and quicker raises.” So, I ask, why the injustice?”

    http://www.personal.psu.edu/afr3/blogs/SIOW/2011/09/why-are-short-people-discriminated-against.html

    It was also obvious that Bafana couldn’t compete in the air with those big okes from Mali. It is just so unjust. bruuuh.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Dmwangi
    February 3, 2013 at 17:42 pm

    “Recall where SA’s foremost jurist stated with finality that whites cannot escape the ‘virus’ of racism that pumps through their veins. Can’t see how virology is a social construct– though am PdV will explain.”

    I know. I have been trying hard to deconstruct that construct but I also have no cure for that virus. That is why I have pinned all hopes on Prof Makgoba who may be able to cure us with beet root smoothies and other traditional African medicines. I have been told that White liberals are especially sensitive to the active ingredient in Beta vulgaris.

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ OG

    You are right. That’s why I say the coach needs to be TRANSFORMED!

    Thanks

  • Brett Nortje

    I’m not Andile’s counterfoil, fool! I don’t go round fantasizing about hurting black people. I particularly do not wish one moment more’s hardship on them.

    I simply try to speak the truth as I see it. And the simple fact is that there are a few black commentators with double-digit IQs who have seized the opportunity we have presented when we point out that a lot of the pieces are being put in place that have been shown to be characteristics and pre-determinants in genocide in other highly divided societies.

    They smell your fear like any predatory animal. Appeasers like you have given these manipulators enormous power when you should be debunking their fantasies by the application of a little cold hard fact. Ask them what Day 2 of the attempted genocide looks like. Day 32.

    Show them that there will be consequences which they will suffer personally.

    Blue Ozone says:
    February 3, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    “Truth is Andile needs people like you to fuel his own genocidal, racist ideology”

  • sirjay jonson

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 3, 2013 at 8:23 am

    Maggs: Have never thought you were one to deny facts. Perhaps its denial of facts that undermines SA progress more than any other issue, even the racism issue so effectively played by race activists.

    To recognize truth, one only has to practice truth consistently, especially with one’s self.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Brett Nortje
    February 4, 2013 at 8:34 am

    “I’m not Andile’s counterfoil, fool! I don’t go round fantasizing about hurting black people. I particularly do not wish one moment more’s hardship on them.”

    I think Andile is telling you that black people have already been hurt and now he want his pound of [white] flesh.

    BTW – dropped an email with links to his “white apocalypse” threat to Genocide Watch. No response, seems the only time they are interested in “genocide news from South Africa” is when they can paint the ANC red with their “Marxist-Leninist” brush. Apparently Andile being a BC demagogue and also rabidly anti-ANC and sponsored by the Ford Foundation amongst others do not fit their target.

    Makes you think, doesn’t broer.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    sirjay jonson
    February 4, 2013 at 9:19 am

    Sirjay,

    “Maggs: Have never thought you were one to deny facts.”

    Which part of that do you find factual?

    Let’s see if we can unpack it.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Ozone Boy,

    How do we get this more demographically representative?

    Almost one third of black South African women are obese, the SA Institute of Race Relations (SAIRR) says.

    “Coloured, white, and Indian women follow closely, with around a quarter being obese,” the institute’s South Africa Survey shows.

    In contrast, 18 percent of all white men are obese, followed by nine percent of Indian, eight percent of coloured, and six percent of black men.

    http://www.timeslive.co.za/lifestyle/2013/02/04/a-third-of-black-south-african-women-obese-study

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 4, 2013 at 10:24 am

    “How do we get this more demographically representative? Almost one third of black South African women are obese, the SA Institute of Race Relations (SAIRR) says.”

    Thx maggs. Glad you asked, clearly what we need is that at least 30% of the 50% of the females on the CC to be obese. It would be even better if they were short and obese, and there should be x% of all the possible combinations of those PDI groups who are either gay or lesbian. We urgently need more accurate demographic information from the SA Institute of Entrenched Apartheid Logic (SAIEAL) to clarify the “x”.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    But I can guarantee that close to 0% quota on the CC will be allocated to poor rural women who have to walk 2km a day to the river for some polluted drinking water while dodging the 15 000 escaped crocodiles from Limpopo.

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ Maggs et OG

    With respect, you two are clearly not trained “lawyers.” That has caused you both to bark up the wrong tree. Allow me to explain: when the Constitution says that judges must be “broadly” representative of South Africans, that does not mean that they must be fat.

    Thanks.

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    Another thing: TRANSFORMATION is not just about the race and weight of individual judges. It is also about getting judges with whose interpretations of the Constitution we can agree.

  • Brett Nortje

    Dworkym that particular elucidation is going to cause great disillusionment among 9/10 ANC leaders.

    P.s. Could you try and find out from OBS where he thinks those crocs came from in the first place?

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 4, 2013 at 11:35 am

    “Another thing: TRANSFORMATION is not just about the race and weight of individual judges. It is also about getting judges with whose interpretations of the Constitution we can agree.”

    That is not what his honourable Judge Yacoob said. He want more chicks on the bench. period.

    I don’t mind as long as they are fit (preferably blonde) and proper.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 4, 2013 at 11:18 am

    Dworky

    “That has caused you both to bark up the wrong tree.”

    Don’t come here with that tendency, that barking tendency – as Professor Zuma wisely said only WHITE people love their dogs.

    Professor Zuma also touched the CAF Cup so that means it will come to South Africa; BTW Bafana did not lose, they differed the win to a later date – as Dmwangi will tell you UBUNTU demands that as host we should not humiliate our guests.

    On fat judges, Brett will tell you that food does not make people fat – people make people fat!

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Blue Ozone

    Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    February 4, 2013 at 11:56 am

    Maggs – I’m sure any one of these females would do just fine.

    http://mybroadband.co.za/photos/data/524/medium/babes.jpg

    Only problem seems to be only cowgirls and no Indians.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje
    February 3, 2013 at 9:47 am

    Hey G,

    “Maggs, do you think I have $1000 to enter a pigeon race?”

    It just struck me that money doesn’t make birds fly, birds make birds fly!

    WDYSTT?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ Maggs

    “money doesn’t make birds fly, birds make birds fly!”

    With respect, you are wasting our precious bandwidth with frivolous debates about pigeon/duck racing etc. Remember, this blog is essentially about “Constitutional Law.” May I suggest that you, Brett, Fassbinder and Blue Ozone hive off into a “satellite blog,” where you can frivilolate to your heart’s content!

    Thanks.

  • Maggs Naidu – Yikes, another seven years! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    February 4, 2013 at 15:30 pm

    Dworky,

    Ducks are also about Constitutional Law.

    Remember the story of the guy who was nicking ducks at the Zoo Lake?

    Apparently the parks department who laid charges after trapping him could not prove in court that they “owned” the wild ducks.

    So now they rewrote the bylaws to make it illegal to remove anything from the city parks.

    Thus people are leaving their waste lying about to comply with the revised by-laws!

    WDYSTT?

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