Constitutional Hill

When is the deployment of our soldiers in another country justified?

In a democracy, the deployment of a country’s soldiers in a foreign land should be a moment of high constitutional importance. It should also be a moment of personal moral anguish for the President who serves as Commander in Chief of the military. After all, the President may well be using his immense powers to send fellow men and women to their deaths, hopefully in order to pursue an important constitutionally justifiable objective. As the unfolding fiasco in the Central African Republic (CAR) illustrates, this has not been the case in South Africa. Perhaps it is time to ask why and to demand some answers.

When George W Bush and his lapdog Tony Blair decided to invade Iraq on the basis of bogus intelligence about the existence of “weapons of mass destruction” in Iraq (weapons which never existed), more than a million people marched through the streets of London to oppose the invasion. However, in the US there was almost no protest from the population at large, perhaps because most US citizens had been whipped into a frenzy by a post 9-11 jingoistic and uncritical media who cheered on the disastrous invasion of Iraq. In the end thousands of US troops were killed in the misadventure and billions of dollars wasted on a war that America should never have gotten involved in.

It has always been perplexing to me that South Africans seem so uninterested in potentially life and death decisions taken by our various Presidents to deploy troops in foreign countries. There has been no debate about the strategic or financial objectives involved in such decisions. Neither has there been any debate about the enormous financial cost involved in deploying our troops elsewhere on the continent. Questions about whether South Africa should act like the USA of Africa, acting as the imperial bully boy of the continent by propping up friendly regimes and destabilising regimes seen as unfriendly have also not been asked.

When would it be acceptable for our President to send South African men and women into harm’s way? Would it be acceptable to send troops into a war zone to take part in African Union and United Nations sanctioned peace keeping missions elsewhere on our continent? Personally, I would suspect that many South Africans would support such actions – even though the money spent on such missions could also be used to buy school textbooks or build school libraries.

But what if there is no UN or African Union backing for a mission? What if we send troops to protect the financial interests of private South African mining companies: would that ever be a good idea? What if we send troops to protect a President who came to power in a coup d’état – as was the case in CAR? Is it acceptable from a strategic, moral and financial point of view to send troops into harm’s way to pursue the vague objective of promoting regional peace and security in a part of the world whose political instability does not directly impact on South Africa?

It is exactly because these are fundamentally important questions that section 201 of the Constitution requires the President to inform Parliament “promptly and in appropriate detail” of the reasons for the deployment of the defence force; any place where the force is being deployed; the number of people involved; and the period for which the force is expected to be deployed. The Defence Act further requires the President to inform Parliament about the estimated cost of any such deployment.

What we do know is that some South African troops were deployed in CAR as part of a VIP protection unit to personally protect the now deposed President Francois Bozize. In 2011 the Department of International Relations and Cooperation explained the mission to CAR as follows:

SANDF deployment in the CAR is divided into two mainly  OP MORERO – a unit of the SANDF Special Forces  that was deployed in CAR to provide VIP protection to President Bozize and Operation Vimbesela – the SANDF’s mission involved in the refurbishment of the military bases and the training of the military personnel on that country.

Others were deployed to assist with the training of the CAR army. When extra troops were sent to CAR in January, we were told these troops were deployed for the following reasons:

The employed members of the SANDF will assist with capacity building of the CAR Defence Force and will also assist CAR with the planning and implementation of the disarmament, demobilisation and re integration processes.

Today we were told a different story, namely that the extra troops were sent to protect South Africa’s assets. But Reuters now quotes “regional peacekeeping sources” to the effect that our soldiers on Saturday had fought alongside CAR soldiers to defend the capital. The President contradicted this today, claiming the soldiers were defending their base against an attack. As is often the case in a war, all these claims should be treated with circumspection.

But if it is true that South Africa fought alongside CAR soldiers against the rebels, it would not be surprising. After all, if the mandate of some of your deployed troops is to serve as the private VIP protection unit of the President under siege, then all your troops – also those ostensibly deployed to help train the CAR army – may very well be sucked into fighting to give that President time to flee from advancing rebels.

At the time of writing we are awaiting further information about the safety of our troops stationed in CAR. All we know is that at least 13 soldiers were killed (one is still missing) and 27 have been injured. We have no idea how they will make it out of there safely or whether, god forbid, we will send more troops to CAR.

But what is astonishing is that the South African public has not really been told what the strategic reasons for the deployment of the troops in CAR might have been. What did South Africa get out of sending troops to CAR to act as a VIP protection force of the President? Why were we spending money on the deployment of troops to train the army of a President who originally came to power in a coup? Were there other – perhaps private financial – reasons for the deployment?

Maybe it is time for the South African public (as well as the members of Parliament) to start asking the difficult questions about our military involvement in the internal affairs of another sovereign state? Do we really want to become the USA bully boy of Africa? I don’t think so. Not only can we not afford it, but as a matter of principle we should surely not ever get involved military in another sovereign state unless we form part of a United Nations or African union peacekeeping force. And how is South Africa going to get the remaining troops safely out of CAR?

Is it not time for ordinary South Africans to raise their voices against our military involvement in the sovereign state of another African country and to begin to act more like those millions people in Britain who saw through the half-truths and the lies of Bush and Blair and protested against the invasion of Iraq and less like the pliant post-9-11 American public who allowed their soldiers to be sent to Iraq to be killed and maimed in their thousands.

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Lmao @Pierre

    “the money spent on such missions could also be used to buy school textbooks or build school libraries.”

    In your dreams maybe.

    Those textbooks and school libraries would benefit the poor.

    As always FUCK THE POOR!

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Justice Malala @justicemalala

    Deeply worried about #Zuma’s language on #CAR. Eg: “Just over 200 (SA soldiers) fought bandits numbering more than a 1000 people.” Bandits?

  • Andrew

    South African Soldiers are DEAD, may they RIP.

    Let’s echo Pierre’s request that the President will tell South Africans candidly and honestly, why our soldiers had to die.

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Andrew
    March 25, 2013 at 12:23 pm

    Andrew,

    “Let’s echo Pierre’s request that the President will tell South Africans candidly and honestly, why our soldiers had to die.”

    Candidly and honestly from our President???

    I dunno but methinks that there’s a higher possibility of finding god.

  • Zoo Keeper

    Prof

    I’ll bet you R10 that some nosy journalist will one day uncover a money-trail to the CAR’s strategic mineral deposits. Our involvement in battle in a country with no strategic or political value to South Africa; on the side of Bozize and not in a neutral role raises very large eye-brows.

    What is really going on up there????????

  • Andrew

    Maggs, you are right of cause, the president is not likely to take us into his confidence.

    What is happening to our constitutional project and how do we bring it back online?

    I’m asking specifically with respect to the question of accountability raised by the Prof.

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Andrew
    March 25, 2013 at 13:02 pm

    Andrew,

    “What is happening to our constitutional project and how do we bring it back online?”

    That’s perhaps the most relevant and important of issues!

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    The constitutional issues aside, I join Mr Zuma in praising our men and women in fighting off a bunch of 1000 BANDITS, a 9 hour battle, after which the BANDITS raised the white flag. These attackers are dead-set against our policy of projecting UBUNTU across Africa.

    Also, I cannot thinking that the hullaballoo of the liberal press is RACIST. Where were all these whingers when the pre-1994 govt was deploying the SADF to fight BANDITS in Namibia, Lesotho etc?

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    March 25, 2013 at 13:21 pm

    Dworky,

    “after which the BANDITS raised the white flag.”

    You lie about the racist-flag thingy.

    The BANDITS asked for a ceasefire (unlike the #Marikana miners!!!!) – probably to go to Ma Khumalo’s tuckshop to get light refreshments.

    NB as soon as they asked for the tuckshop break, according to Professor Zuma, they became REBELS!

    These #CleverBlack okes in #CAR are tricky fellows – sort of like the aliens in the Transformers – from bandits to rebels in the flick of an eye!

  • spoiler

    RIP SANDF soldiers indeed. Its reminiscent of the bad old days but at least then, the political and probably economic basis for the war in Angola was more apparent. If this has just been our esteemed leadern using our soldiers and money protecting financial interests and the well being of another dictator, then it is a travesty.

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Bandit to rebel to PRESIDENT!

    Reminds me of our President – rebel, president, bandit.

    Some space for a few titles too – Reverend, Excellency, Highness, Doctor, Pastor, professor …

    Bangui – Michel Djotodia, one of the leaders of the rebel group which invaded the capital of the Central African Republic over the weekend, toppling the nation’s president, is telling a French radio station he is the de facto head of state.

    Asked if people should now address him as Mr President, Djotodia told RFI in an interview broadcast on Monday: “I can consider myself to be, at this moment, the head of state.”

    http://www.news24.com/Africa/News/Consider-me-head-of-state-CAR-rebel-20130325-2

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Zuma must go.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Interesting facts here:

    1) One of the world’s poorest countries
    2) The former French colony has a history of rebellions
    3) Its most infamous leader was Jean-Bedel Bokassa, who declared himself emperor
    4) Average life expectancy is 39 years
    5)Diamonds are an important source of income – and rivalry

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-21923624

    But luckily its people escaped the untold horrors of Apartheid.

  • Dumisani

    I smell a Gupta …

  • Blacklisted Hardliner

    We are US bully of Africa. We send our boys there to protect the interests of some private citizen there. Do not worry, we will donate funeral costs to their familes and label them heroes. Soon after fenural, we will go drink wine . This is what you get when you vote ex convicts into power.

  • Blacklisted Hardliner

    We were protecting a president who is a product of coup. Don’t you think other civilians do not want to be president as well?

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    And elsewhere in Afrika.

    “Zambia’s ex-President Rupiah Banda Zambia’s ex-President Rupiah Banda denies corruption charges against him.

    Zambia’s former President Rupiah Banda has been arrested in connection with a Nigerian oil deal, officials say.

    He is accused of stealing more than $11m (£7m) during his three years in office, Reuters news agency reports.

    Mr Banda who was stripped of presidential immunity earlier this month, was questioned for nearly three hours before being freed on bail.

    The former president denies the charges and says he is the victim of a witch-hunt. He is due in court on Tuesday.

    Shortly after being released, Mr Banda addressed his supporters, telling them to remain calm and that he would win the case in court.”

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-21925752

  • Oupoot

    It was not only the collapse of the USSR that brought greater stability in Africa, but also the collapse of apartheid SA interfering in other African countries. SA Special Forces, or Recce’s as they were known then, were actively involved in countries throughout SADC, with spies also supporting one or another faction. The aim was to keep them fighting each other and not turn their focus & attention to apartheid SA.

    What message are we sending to Africa if we once again let our Special Forces get involved in the internal affairs of other countries? More so if its under our own flag and not that of the AU/UN, as is the case of our involvement in the DRC, Sudan, Burundi, etc. Even the incursion in late 1990s into Lesotho was under the SADC banner.

    A note of caution: a contributing factor towards the situation in Zim was their army getting involved in the DRC war in the late 1990s. It definitely changed the power dynamics in Zim in favour of the military (-industrial-complex). Not to say the current situation in the CAR is the same as the DRC in the late 1990s, but we must remain vigilant that the same dont happen here, especially with our militant/military history of both the apartheid govt and the liberation armies, mixed with the most corrupt business industry (i.e. arms industry).

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Dumisani
    March 25, 2013 at 15:26 pm

    “I smell a Gupta …”

    I know. It is always the fault of a privileged White or a bargaining Indian.

    Never, never an African.

  • Gwebecimele

    This is the beauty of constitutional democracy and South Africans are making their choices. Many are neither unhappy nor informed about these decisions.

    Before this incident, how many citizens were aware of this mission?
    It might be unrealistic to request the many, who are unaware about these elite missions to be concerned or request accountability.

    Even for the politicians this is not the stuff that bring them votes.

    The seven faceless young men who died (during a marathon hosted by a municipality) after christmas in KZN are almost forgotten. Many South Africans have died due to various causes, some preventable.
    Our reaction remains constant.

  • Zoo Keeper

    Anyway Prof. back to the central theme.

    For me it is justified to send troops to a foreign nation when it is in the country’s best interests. This means it must be beneficial to the country as a whole and not a select group.

    There must be concrete strategic advantage or political capital to be derived from the deployment.If we needed the port of Maputo for example, and had to deploy troops to keep it open for our own benefit.

    Its all about context. However, I can see none of that in the CAR. Although it does have significant mineral resources but is in no way linked to SA…

    Deployment of troops to foreign nations for peacekeeping is justified but clearly ours were not peace-keeping and were very clearly on Bozize’s side. So we were there for factional support. Why?

    JZ needs to tell Parliament what benefit SA derived from this deployment.

    However, I have serious doubts he will ever take SA into his confidence!

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    Maggs, I say it is unfair to compare our goodwill excursion in CAR with U.S. aggression around the globe. For me, Amerikans represent the “GREAT SATAN” who have killed billions in their imperialistic crusades and Zionist campaigns. Even today, the US and the ZIONISTS continue to bully the Democratic Republic of Korea and the son-of-the-Dear-Leader, who wants only PEACE. Floyd Shivambu will explain!

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Zoo Keeper
    March 25, 2013 at 17:06 pm

    LOL ZooKy,

    “JZ needs to tell Parliament what benefit SA derived from this deployment.”

    Do you think that Professor Zuma gives a rat’s arse about what parliament thinks?

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder
    March 25, 2013 at 17:30 pm

    “Maggs, I say it is unfair to compare our goodwill excursion in CAR with U.S. aggression around the globe. For me, Amerikans represent the “GREAT SATAN” who have killed billions in their imperialistic crusades and Zionist campaigns. Even today, the US and the ZIONISTS continue to bully the Democratic Republic of Korea and the son-of-the-Dear-Leader, who wants only PEACE. Floyd Shivambu will explain!”

  • Dumisani

    Ozoneblue says:
    March 25, 2013 at 17:02 pm

    The racist (racial) angle was not necessary…

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Unilateralism.

    It means like USA/UK we have shunned international consent in pursuit of private interest, i.e. global capitalism. But then we are very much aligned on the Anglo-American axis. British colony….Anglo-American…Margaret/Mark Thatcher…BAE…Barclays…Lonmin.

    Read between the dotted lines.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Dumisani
    March 25, 2013 at 20:57 pm

    So what was totally fucking irrelevant slur about “the Guptas” all about?

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Ozoneblue
    March 25, 2013 at 21:06 pm

    Ozone Guy,

    It looks like you have ozone damage to your lights upstairs!

    Dumisani’s comment was far more nuanced than your little racist brain was able to interpret!

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    “As a result the donor community severely restricted aid flows pending movement towards democracy putting the country into a vicious cycle in which it could not obtain the resources to pay for an election which would legitimize it suffiently to obtain a flow of aid. When he was pressured by the international community, via a group of locally represented international donors called GIBAFOR (France, USA, Germany, Japan, EU, World Bank and UN), including a very vocal and eloquent US ambassador to the Central African Republic, Daniel H. Simpson, to hold fair elections. They were assisted by the UN Electoral Assistance Unit and monitored by international observers in 1992 but a lot of the resources came from France. Kolingba had the 1992 election sabotaged as he discovered he was not expected to win the vote and so declared the election invalid getting the Constitutional Council cancel it. Under continued pressure from the donor group the election was rescheduled for September 1993.[9] In the 1993 election, Bozizé ran for the presidency as an independent, receiving 12,159 votes, 1.5% of the total votes cast.[10] Patassé, Abel Goumba and Kolingba received 37.32%, 21.68% and 12.10% of the vote, respectively, but since none of the candidates obtained a majority, a run-off election between the top two candidates—Patassé and Goumba—was held. Patassé defeated Goumba by a 53.49%–46.51% vote and was elected president of the Central African Republic.”

    Francois_Bozize (wiki entry)

    “Banana republic is a political science term for a politically unstable country whose economy is largely dependent on the export of a single limited-resource product, such as fruits or minerals. It typically has stratified social classes, including a large, impoverished working class and a ruling plutocracy that comprises the elites of business, politics, and the military.[1] This politico-economic oligarchy controls the primary-sector productions and thereby exploits the country’s economy. [2]”

    Banana Republic [wiki entry]

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfMwWLnpgGw

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)
    March 25, 2013 at 21:14 pm

    Thank you maggs. For – despite your own numerous shortcomings in this area, you were once again able, not only to identify, but also pronounce on somebody else’s RACISM. There is no other virtue in life I appreciate more than a total lack of self-consciousness.

    If it wasn’t for that – even this author and his blog would not be around.

  • Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?

    Lusaka tower, this is Green Leader. How do you read?

  • Mikhail Dworkin Fassbinder

    @ Brett

    “How do you read?”

    Easy! I observe how individual “letters” are arranged to form WORDS. Then I note the syntactical placement of each WORD into a SENTENCE, to which I then attribute denotative or connotative MEANING!

    Thanks.

  • Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?

    Lusaka tower, this is Green Leader.

  • Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?

    Lusaka tower this is Green Leader. This is a message for the station commander at Mumbwa from the Rhodesian Air Force. We are attacking the terrorist base at Westlands Farm. This attack is against Rhodesian dissidents and not against Zambia. Rhodesia has no quarrel, repeat, no quarrel with Zambia or her security forces. We therefore ask you not to intervene or oppose our attack. However, we are orbiting your airfield now and are under orders to shoot down any Zambian Air Force aircraft, which does not comply with this request and attempts to take off.

    Did you copy all that?

  • Gwebecimele

    Who knows may be CAR might (return the favour) one day drive down here and protect a sitting President.

  • Mike

    @MDF – Attackers dont raise a white flag when they are repelled, they withdraw.The white flag story from Zuma is confirmation of one big bullshit story being fed to the public and General Constance Viljoen must be shaking his head at the AA MK generals decision to hang South African soldiers out to dry in the CAR.
    This is the consequence of a corrupt Cadre rat infested ANC goverment that tried to bluff it way in Africa as being a force to reckon with.
    Being a VIP protection unit for CAR president means one thing and that is you gave up the SANDF soldiers neutrality.
    What a fucking disaster but what more can one expect from AA MK leadership in the defence force who made a point of staying as far a away from the SADF as possible in Angola and confined to themselves to bombing civilains in Wimpey bars.

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Gwebecimele
    March 26, 2013 at 11:15 am

    Gwebs,

    Who knows maybe the CAR President is sitting here protecting our interests in the Michaelangelo which was donated to us by Brother Leader before he peacefully passed away.

    There’s a plan behind our strategy of protecting despots – they come here with their money, they die or return as heroes to their countries. And we get to keep the cash (“we” means those in control of the levers of state, of course)

    Anyway – 16 soldiers, 32 miners, some activists – these are non-people really!

    I suppose when Zuma is eventually challenged about this awful “deployment” his response will inferThat’s how democracy works (iow I can do any shit I like and you can do fuck all about it)!

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mike
    March 26, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    Hey Mike,

    Perhaps the MK was as awful as you imply.

    But then why did the entire “powerful” apartheid military/police/security might collapse?

    Did they decide that being shitheads was un-Christian?

  • beetle

    Dumisane, you have a point.
    Why not defend a despot at the taxpayers expense, and get a kickback in say diamonds? Small and travel easily across borders and in a military pocket.
    It could smell of Gupta. Will we ever know?
    I am beginning to get psychotic!

  • Chris

    Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com) says:
    March 26, 2013 at 12:57 pm

    “Did they decide that being shitheads was un-Christian?”

    Exactly what happened!

  • Zoo Keeper

    Maggs

    That’s how democracy works (iow I can do any shit I like and you can do fuck all about it)!

    :)

    That is just about the best summation of democracy under the ANC I have ever read!

  • Mike

    @Maggs – De Klerk fired 17 Generals from the Defense force and effectively disbanded the SADF hiearchy to placate the ANC.
    The fact of the matter as DESMOND TUTU has reminded the ANC, is that the SADF were nver once defeated in battle and on not one occasion did the Cuban FAPLA forces enter Namibia.
    The factual storey which is hardly the characteristics of a victorious army and the Soviet General in charge was executed for “criminal activities”.
    There was a lot of sacrifice from young white south africans to ensure that red Ronnie Kasirils never achived his wet dream of riding on a T54 up to the Union Buildings flying the hammer and sickle.

  • Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?

    EUREKA!

    Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com) says:
    March 26, 2013 at 12:57 pm

  • Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?

    Cuban General. Oacha Sanchez.

    Mike says:
    March 26, 2013 at 13:34 pm

  • Mike

    @Maggs – “The factual story of Cuito Cuanavale is that the Cuban Fapla forces withdrew”

  • Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?

    The best definition of fascism I’ve ever heard was given by Larry Pratt.

    He says fascism is the use of public power for private personal ends.

    When our leaders used public power they used it to protect the ‘we’.

    Same thing with the Rhodies above.

    When black leaders use public power they use it to prey. For predation. As the zombi and his generals showed us in the DRC.

    South Africa is almost where Zimbabwe was. 1999.

    Anyone care to deny it?

  • Gwebecimele

    I believe the rebels have “apologised” and are requesting “capacity building assistance” similar to the ex-prez.

  • Maggs Naidu – Happy human rights day! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mike
    March 26, 2013 at 13:34 pm

    Hey Mike,

    Is that the story that you were told?

    It just goes to show you CAN fool some of the people all of the time, ne!

  • Maggs Naidu – Go tell your granny! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?
    March 26, 2013 at 13:34 pm

    Hey Brett – I’m thinking of giving you some advice, but some people will get angry.

    I bet you know what I’d like to suggest!

  • Mike

    @Maggs – When it comes to commenting on the SADF you are out of your league. What the ANC propagandists, to which you subscribe, dont take into account is that many of us got first hand information from those that took part by virtue of the fact that we associated with one another when we were called up for army camps.
    Our information is quite accurate, you have had to rely on the same source that is busy right now feeding this country bullshit about what happened in the CAR.
    Only soldiers in fear of being over run when defending a position raise a white flag, never never would an attacking force, they would simply withdraw like the Cubans did at Cuito Cuanavale.
    One thing for sure is that when they release the names of the soldiers that died in the CAR I doubt very much that we would see an indian name.
    You would rather support the corrupt ANC and the theft of R27 billion a year from the tax payer than ensure the military was properly equiped with that R27 billion.

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Mike
    March 26, 2013 at 13:37 pm

    “@Maggs – “The factual story of Cuito Cuanavale is that the Cuban Fapla forces withdrew””

    Cubans?

    Don’t know where you get that from, some fairy tale version of history. What would those privileged WHITES be doing fighting against Apartheid?

  • Brett Nortje – 19 years of ANC rule! Is South Africa FUBAR?

    I resent the inference!

    I’ll have you know the Indian Navy was lying hull down from Durban (a couple of Zulus had klapped a handful of Indian okes in the street so Nehru sent in the cavalry) with all their guns trained on the CBD when the commander of Durban naval base ran up the white flag.

    Mike says:
    March 26, 2013 at 14:47 pm

    One thing for sure is that when they release the names of the soldiers that died in the CAR I doubt very much that we would see an indian name.

  • Maggs Naidu – Go tell your granny! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mike
    March 26, 2013 at 14:47 pm

    Mike, Mike, Mike (like the CTM ad guy)

    “@Maggs – When it comes to commenting on the SADF you are out of your league.”

    Ok let’s see. Your side was super duper, hunky dory, lean-clean-fighting-machine + other stuff.

    My side was like the military equivalent of Bafana Bafana.

    But guess what?

    WE WON!

    “I doubt very much that we would see an indian name”

    Of course not.

    Indian people don’t fight – we are peace loving. And we spend time doing what all humans should be doing i.e. population growth Ozone Guy will explain

    (sort of p.s. our secret weapon is Jamal Kota – would you like to try some?)

    “You would rather support the corrupt ANC and the theft of R27 billion a year from the tax payer than ensure the military was properly equiped with that R27 billion.”

    Well put. Stealing money is better because nobody gets killed. If MY PRESIDENT, the Honourable, His Excellency, Reverend, Pastor, Doctor, Professor Zuma sent well equipped troops to #CAR many innocent bandits/rebels/FREEDOM fighters/activists (choose applicable) would have died. So in pursuit of a better life for all I choose stealing, plundering, thieving from the state coffers and WHITE people to war any day.

    WDYSTT?

  • Mike

    @Maggs – guess what? you didnt win that is why Afirmative Action US style has now become transformation ie an attempt at ethnic cleansing.

  • Mike

    @Brett Nortje – In true indian style the indian navy was lying hull down in Mauritius some 4000km away.The authority that took charge of the 1948 attack by blacks on indians was the Royal Navy based in Durban.

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mike
    March 26, 2013 at 20:08 pm

    Hey Mike,

    “@Maggs – guess what? you didnt win”

    LMAO!

    Is that what you were told?

    And it seems that you believe it.

    It goes to show, some people (meaning you) can be fooled ALL THE TIME!

    p.s. Wanna buy the Eiffel Tower cheap?

  • http://www.ozoneblue.co.za/ Ozoneblue

    Mike
    March 26, 2013 at 20:08 pm

    “you didnt win that is why Afirmative Action US style has now become transformation ie *an attempt* at ethnic cleansing.”

    I would not say its is premeditated. It is a palatable political solution thought out in collaboration with the powers that be. For most whites it amounts to gradual ethnic cleansing. If it remains “race based” exploiting ingrained and apartheid inherited racial prejudice, which is the only way the ANC can sell it to the bulk of our people, they stay in government serving the black and white elite without capitulating to real socialist policies serving democracy and the common man no matter what their colour.

  • Mike

    @Maggs – De Klerk was very astute in passing the poisened chalice onto the ANC.Your saw what happened recently at Sasolburg, that what will happen again in KZN to Indian businesses.

  • Sabelo Mthombeni

    Interesting pierce! Can somebody tell me, what is the role of parliament in the deployment of troops????

  • Maggs Naidu – Towards a DUTY-FREE Cabinet! (maggsnaidu@hotmail.com)

    Mike
    March 27, 2013 at 7:50 am

    Hey Mike,

    “@Maggs – De Klerk was very astute in passing the poisened chalice onto the ANC.Your saw what happened recently at Sasolburg, that what will happen again in KZN to Indian businesses.”

    What’s de Klerk gonna do to Indian businesses in KZN?

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